Liberal Forum

Cannonpointer » 04 May 2014 4:43 am » wrote: **** Americans out of jobs is sort of my main complaint.

And conjob jurisdictions are now starting to outlaw off-grid housing. http://www.collective-evolution.com/201 ... city-grid/ And no grid will allow solar panels to connect unless they are UL approved. So, yeah - you can build them - you just can't use them.
There ain't no "cozy" to it. They are a gate keeper against free enterprise, **** Americans out of jobs - full stop. At the price at which we can produce solar panels, China cannot afford the shipping. We could TRANSFORM our electrical conversation, and cut our carbon foot print by a full 2.53 **** loads.

This is one proof among many of the real battle ground for America's soul: CAPITALISM VS. FREE ENTERPRISE. The fate of our nation rides on the outcome. Anyone with children needs to pick a **** side.

Sometimes I wonder why I give a **** in the bathos and pathos cloud that some people live in.
I don't even have kids and I give more thought to the long term outcomes than "parents" seem to.
You seem to have a bigger picture in mind as well. Some tiny detail can overwhelm an entire situation. You or I may see it and wonder why everyone else is focussed on that partisan spin **** like a group of retards.
You happened to read a post or two of mine quite a while back as I read some of yours. A detent was reached when something clicked for us both. We don't agree on some stuff but there is a thin commonality in the bigger picture sometimes ever since. Thin as it may be, it fattens here again. Our overlap on the next generation(s) is showing.
I have said I do actually learn things here once in a while. That is partly why I bolded your above statement. As I said, I don't even have children and I find that the "leavings" for the next set of adults are important. Admitting there's a problem is the first step and your statement helps to flesh out that message. I hope people keep it in mind.

To be continued to armageddon...


ps
I could tell you stories about re-quoting jobs to India and China. I am very aware.

Oh just shut the **** up, birther-AGW denier.

danobivins » 06 May 2014 2:12 pm » wrote:Oh just shut the **** up, birther-AGW denier.

Birther isn't a word in your sense. Since you are a liar and kind of stupid, I'm certain you can't come close to any serious comment I've ever made about the Kenyan cum U.S. president. That's a good one. Must be just a locked and loaded "insult" I don't think I've even called him mulatto much less what you think of most of the time, racist ****.
Good luck with your disgust with me. That you hate me makes me feel I'm alright. Being hated by human debris is a good thing.
Sorry I can't extend the same to you. Just some fuzzy notion of . . . I guess, pity. Grow up a bit. It doesn't hurt.

The Kenyan is a boogeyman farting the world away. KGW

birther-AGW denier?

Cannonpointer » 02 May 2014 10:35 pm » wrote:Instead of definitions, let's talk functions.

Look at the materials required to construct a solar panel.They cost about $200.00. Add a day's labor to that $200.00, and you've got yourself a solar panel. You could sell iffor $400.00, and you've got yourself a job. So, why isn't anyone doing it?We live in a free enterprise economy, do we not?

Not.

We live in a capitalist economy, which games the system to PREVENT free enterprise. You are not allowed to sell your solar panels without a stamp of approval from Underwriters Laboratories -and they are gate keepers for Wall Street.The cost of shaking hands with UL prevents free enterprisers from operating in that market -and the same thing is going on in almost every market. The little guy is locked out by the engineered and manipulated expense of sitting at the table - locked out. Only Wall Streeters, using OTHER PEOPLES' capital, can afford to play in the game.

We need to go back to a free enterprise economy, where the little guy does not face unsurmountable obstacles to starting a small business.

What a foolish idea of selling. All that needs to be done is to use something with an Underwriters Lab tag on it in making the unit. Many companies use an electric cord with one.

Also the materials to create a solar panel of any usability for electric power will require much more than $200. First a solar panel of enough power output is required. Then a bank of batteries are connected to it. From the batteries an inverter to create 120 volts that can can sync with the power company. Those three basic parts of creating electricity from solar panels cost much more than $200.

greatnpowerfuloz » 05 May 2014 10:46 am » wrote: It was not a refutation. It was a not very subtle expression of disappointment in your inability to acknowledge anyone else and a clue you can take with you as to why some of us are now passing by your extremely partisan rants.

I admit I am partisan. What are you??? I was a Democrat under Kennedy and Johnson. I applauded the idea of the War on Poverty. Then I was a foster parent just north of Detroit and had my face rammed into the Democrats way of doing things in Detroit and what the war on poverty accomplished with the poor blacks. Both were very ugly. This was back in the 80's. Detroit was killing business by making lots of regulations on businesse and raising taxes on everyone. The flood out of Detroit was in full swing when I moved there. Business men that were interviewd said these where what drove them out of Detroit. People said the taxes on them were too much so they followed the businesses. Houses could not be sold so people just abandoned them and gave quit claim deeds to the banks.

The poor blacks under Kennedy were tight knit religious families and when I moved there there was a lot of young women on ADC having children out of wedlock. the more kids the more money. The children were running wild and most of them were dropping out of school. If a man lived there all money would stop. The girls got their apartment by doing what mom and grandma did. Get pregnant and get a free apartment, money for them and money for each child they had. Unwed mothers are almost always in poverty and this ADC program supported more amd more of them.

THIS IS WHY I AM NO LONGER A LIBERAL
I LOOKED AT THE RESULTS OF LIBERALISM
I HAD MY FACE MASHED IN IT

I notice that you do what all liberals do is ignore the facts I present. Tell me how any company can start of with that mountain of regulations and keep them. Stossel had them in a stack on a show and it was a 1 yard cube with a 2 foot pyramid on top. This was a while back so it is taller now. What is the Obama response to the fact that companies are moving out of the Country? Doing what Detroit did. Keep on adding more regulations and creating more taxes. He is getting the same results that Detroit did. For the companies that want to stay in the US look at what is happening to California that is following the Detroit method. They are leaving in a flood and going to the shunshine belt where they have no income tax, right to work, and much less regulations, Texas and Florida especially. What is the response of liberals here??? They are going to unsafe working conditions, workers are at the mercy of horrid businessmen. The problem is that I worked for over 30 years for a telemetry company in Florida and that idea that they rant is idiocy. Why do liberals think that bosses are just evil. They are people with feelings like everyone else and want the best for their employees.

LIBERALS NEVER DISCUSS THE ISSUES
LIBERALS CALL STATING FACTS RANTING

GeorgeWashington » 06 May 2014 10:44 am » wrote:
What part if wikis definition do you take issue or disagree with?

Crony capitalism is a term describing an economy in which success in business depends on close relationships between business people and government officials. It may be exhibited by favoritism in the distribution of legal permits, government grants, special tax breaks, or other forms of state interventionism.[1][2] Crony capitalism is believed to arise when business cronyism and related self-serving behavior by businesses or businesspeople spills over into politics and government,[3] or when self-serving friendships and family ties between businessmen and the government influence the economy and society to the extent that it corrupts public-serving economic and political ideals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crony_capitalism

I already told you - the lies, of omission and commission. Why is there is no such thing as crony free enterprise? Please - take 30 seconds on that question. Why do we never hear about crony free enterprise? If cronyism is something that capitalism is a "victim" of, why doesn't cronyism ever "victimize" free enterprise?

There is no such thing as crony capitalism.

There is free enterprise, and there is capitalism - and the rest is just politically correct ****. Your silly assed wiki definition of capitalism, if read by an uninitiated person, would leave them no way to distinguish between what bill gates does and what the greek restaurant on the corner does - and that is silly, bordering on infantile. It gives the reader all the power and all the distinctions of a participant in a mud pie making session. Don't forget to make that mud pie pretty, because the princess is coming over and might be famished.

deezer shoove » 06 May 2014 10:58 am » wrote: Sometimes I wonder why I give a **** in the bathos and pathos cloud that some people live in.
I don't even have kids and I give more thought to the long term outcomes than "parents" seem to.
You seem to have a bigger picture in mind as well. Some tiny detail can overwhelm an entire situation. You or I may see it and wonder why everyone else is focussed on that partisan spin **** like a group of retards.
You happened to read a post or two of mine quite a while back as I read some of yours. A detent was reached when something clicked for us both. We don't agree on some stuff but there is a thin commonality in the bigger picture sometimes ever since. Thin as it may be, it fattens here again. Our overlap on the next generation(s) is showing.
I have said I do actually learn things here once in a while. That is partly why I bolded your above statement. As I said, I don't even have children and I find that the "leavings" for the next set of adults are important. Admitting there's a problem is the first step and your statement helps to flesh out that message. I hope people keep it in mind.

To be continued to armageddon...

ps
I could tell you stories about re-quoting jobs to India and China. I am very aware.

Spoken as a Jedi...

Endoscopy » 07 May 2014 3:08 pm » wrote:
I admit I am partisan. What are you??? I was a Democrat under Kennedy and Johnson. I applauded the idea of the War on Poverty. Then I was a foster parent just north of Detroit and had my face rammed into the Democrats way of doing things in Detroit and what the war on poverty accomplished with the poor blacks. Both were very ugly. This was back in the 80's. Detroit was killing business by making lots of regulations on businesse and raising taxes on everyone. The flood out of Detroit was in full swing when I moved there. Business men that were interviewd said these where what drove them out of Detroit. People said the taxes on them were too much so they followed the businesses. Houses could not be sold so people just abandoned them and gave quit claim deeds to the banks.

The poor blacks under Kennedy were tight knit religious families and when I moved there there was a lot of young women on ADC having children out of wedlock. the more kids the more money. The children were running wild and most of them were dropping out of school. If a man lived there all money would stop. The girls got their apartment by doing what mom and grandma did. Get pregnant and get a free apartment, money for them and money for each child they had. Unwed mothers are almost always in poverty and this ADC program supported more amd more of them.

THIS IS WHY I AM NO LONGER A LIBERAL
I LOOKED AT THE RESULTS OF LIBERALISM
I HAD MY FACE MASHED IN IT

I notice that you do what all liberals do is ignore the facts I present. Tell me how any company can start of with that mountain of regulations and keep them. Stossel had them in a stack on a show and it was a 1 yard cube with a 2 foot pyramid on top. This was a while back so it is taller now. What is the Obama response to the fact that companies are moving out of the Country? Doing what Detroit did. Keep on adding more regulations and creating more taxes. He is getting the same results that Detroit did. For the companies that want to stay in the US look at what is happening to California that is following the Detroit method. They are leaving in a flood and going to the shunshine belt where they have no income tax, right to work, and much less regulations, Texas and Florida especially. What is the response of liberals here??? They are going to unsafe working conditions, workers are at the mercy of horrid businessmen. The problem is that I worked for over 30 years for a telemetry company in Florida and that idea that they rant is idiocy. Why do liberals think that bosses are just evil. They are people with feelings like everyone else and want the best for their employees.

LIBERALS NEVER DISCUSS THE ISSUES

We see what we choose to see. Welfare was a conservative attempt under the Democrat Lyndon Johnson to keep blacks from rioting when they realized that Civil Rights did not actually change the reality on the ground. White -owned corporations and businesses STILL weren't going to hire them. HUD corralled them into ghettos and the Federal government covered their basic expenses. Without any other measures designed to change the landscape, what did we think would happen? Both Republican and Democratic administrations and Congresses have maintained the status quo.

There was an attempt in the 70's to move blacks out of the ghettos and into the mainstream until Reagan came along and decided that illegal immigrants deserved the lower wage jobs more than the blacks they were intended for.

You blame the blacks themselves for the lot that has been forced upon them. I blame the reluctance of both parties to legislate the difficult measures necessary to lift blacks from both poverty and discrimination - from where we put them in the first place.

Go ahead and ignore these facts, bozo. It's what your partisan heart dictates you do.

Cannonpointer » 07 May 2014 4:47 pm » wrote: Spoken as a Jedi...

There is a school of thought that suggests free enterprise will inevitably lead to capitalism. Greed cannot be reined in by reason, desire or good intentions.

On a lighter and more hopeful note, I hold the opinion that we've had such a gutful of capitalism, it will take centuries for free enterprise to make the leap to capitalism again, if we ever manage to get back to a free enterprise system.

Free enterprise is a farce! Unless you tow the liberal PC line, you can forget about it...

Fascists on a roll.

I had never heard of David Benham until just now, probably because I'm not a fan of home improvement shows. But a lot of people had, and thought highly not only of his home improvement skills but also his screen presence, which is why he and his twin brother Jason were slated to host a show on HGTV called Flip It Forward.

But you can forget about that. The folks at Right Wing Watch (who are also big fans of mine, by the way) have "exposed" Benham as a Christian who openly supports the traditional definition of marriage and opposes the attempts of homosexual activists to change it. These days, that disqualifies you from being on television, a fact that has LGBTQ Nation pretty pumped:

The announcement comes following a report by Right Wing Watch that David Benham is a conservative activist who has campaigned against LGBT equality and reproductive rights, following in the footsteps of his father, preacher Flip Benham, who has headed the abortion-clinic protest group Operation Save America.

In 2012, David Benham led a prayer rally outside of the Democratic National Convention in Charlotte, N.C., which he told conservative radio host Janet Mefferd was needed to stop “homosexuality and its agenda that is attacking the nation” and “demonic ideologies tak[ing] our universities and our public school systems”

He told Mefferd that his brother Jason joined him in organizing the DNC prayer protest.

In a 2012 blog post on Operation Save America’s website, David Benham likened the fight against marriage equality to opposing Nazi Germany.

Now let's understand exactly why HGTV caved here. It's not because they give a rip one way or the other about gay rights. It's because they know exactly what's going to happen if they put this show on TV, which is that gay activists will relentlessly hound the network itself, as well as their advertisers, and raise such a ruckus that it just wouldn't be worth the extra effort that would be required to make the show profitable.

That's how fascism works in America today. The fascists get what they want by making it virtually impossible for anyone to have an association with whomever they have targeted. HGTV just plain doesn't want the hassle that they now realize would be inevitable. It has nothing whatsoever to do with how good the show would be.

For their part, the Benham brothers appear to recognize you sometimes have to pay the price for obedience to God:

“The first and last thought on our minds as we begin and end each day is; have we shined Christ’s light today? Our faith is the fundamental calling in our lives, and the centerpiece of who we are. As Christians we are called to love our fellow man.

“Anyone who suggests that we hate homosexuals or people of other faiths is either misinformed or lying. Over the last decade, we’ve sold thousands of homes with the guiding principle of producing value and breathing life into each family that has crossed our path, and we do not, nor will we ever discriminate against people who do not share our views.

“We were saddened to hear HGTV’s decision. With all of the grotesque things that can be seen and heard on television today you would think there would be room for two twin brothers who are faithful to our families, committed to biblical principles, and dedicated professionals. If our faith costs us a television show then so be it.”

Amen. Looks like someone needs to launch at TV channel that isn't afraid of these people. You think?
http://www.caintv.com/hgtv-axes-planned-show-because

So here you have a couple of guys trying to exercise their free enterprise rights, but because they might not be so PC, are prevented from doing so. I now have to convince my wife to stop watching HGTV!! Dammit....that's going to be a battle!

On a lighter and more hopeful note, I hold the opinion that we've had such a gutful of capitalism, it will take centuries for free enterprise to make the leap to capitalism again, if we ever manage to get back to a free enterprise system.

Things might get better, if technology is used to benefit everyone rather than just be used by the few to exploit the rest. Or perhaps things will go the way of Battlestar Galactica, and sentient robots become the new plebs.

rayj » 08 May 2014 12:57 pm » wrote:Free enterprise is a farce! Unless you tow the liberal PC line, you can forget about it...

Fascists on a roll.

I had never heard of David Benham until just now, probably because I'm not a fan of home improvement shows. But a lot of people had, and thought highly not only of his home improvement skills but also his screen presence, which is why he and his twin brother Jason were slated to host a show on HGTV called Flip It Forward.

But you can forget about that. The folks at Right Wing Watch (who are also big fans of mine, by the way) have "exposed" Benham as a Christian who openly supports the traditional definition of marriage and opposes the attempts of homosexual activists to change it. These days, that disqualifies you from being on television, a fact that has LGBTQ Nation pretty pumped:

The announcement comes following a report by Right Wing Watch that David Benham is a conservative activist who has campaigned against LGBT equality and reproductive rights, following in the footsteps of his father, preacher Flip Benham, who has headed the abortion-clinic protest group Operation Save America.

In 2012, David Benham led a prayer rally outside of the Democratic National Convention in Charlotte, N.C., which he told conservative radio host Janet Mefferd was needed to stop “homosexuality and its agenda that is attacking the nation” and “demonic ideologies tak[ing] our universities and our public school systems”

He told Mefferd that his brother Jason joined him in organizing the DNC prayer protest.

In a 2012 blog post on Operation Save America’s website, David Benham likened the fight against marriage equality to opposing Nazi Germany.

Now let's understand exactly why HGTV caved here. It's not because they give a rip one way or the other about gay rights. It's because they know exactly what's going to happen if they put this show on TV, which is that gay activists will relentlessly hound the network itself, as well as their advertisers, and raise such a ruckus that it just wouldn't be worth the extra effort that would be required to make the show profitable.

That's how fascism works in America today. The fascists get what they want by making it virtually impossible for anyone to have an association with whomever they have targeted. HGTV just plain doesn't want the hassle that they now realize would be inevitable. It has nothing whatsoever to do with how good the show would be.

For their part, the Benham brothers appear to recognize you sometimes have to pay the price for obedience to God:

“The first and last thought on our minds as we begin and end each day is; have we shined Christ’s light today? Our faith is the fundamental calling in our lives, and the centerpiece of who we are. As Christians we are called to love our fellow man.

“Anyone who suggests that we hate homosexuals or people of other faiths is either misinformed or lying. Over the last decade, we’ve sold thousands of homes with the guiding principle of producing value and breathing life into each family that has crossed our path, and we do not, nor will we ever discriminate against people who do not share our views.

“We were saddened to hear HGTV’s decision. With all of the grotesque things that can be seen and heard on television today you would think there would be room for two twin brothers who are faithful to our families, committed to biblical principles, and dedicated professionals. If our faith costs us a television show then so be it.”

Amen. Looks like someone needs to launch at TV channel that isn't afraid of these people. You think?
http://www.caintv.com/hgtv-axes-planned-show-because

So here you have a couple of guys trying to exercise their free enterprise rights, but because they might not be so PC, are prevented from doing so. I now have to convince my wife to stop watching HGTV!! Dammit....that's going to be a battle!

No one on this board has heard of that guy or that ridiculous station. But the guy needs to decide a career path - activist, or celebrity. Very few people have ever managed to become a celebrity AFTER being an activist, kid.

Why should the station take on an unknown who is already on an enemies list? Most stations look for people WITHOUT baggage, to launch to stardom. He's not the only guy who knows how to swing a hammer. If he wants to be on "This Old Protest Show," or on, "Flip this Protest," he needs to find a different sponsor. Why is he bothering people who just want to make an entertaining and educational show about home repair? He should be out beating up queers, between bouts of undercover bathrooming.

Do you see them lining up an out queer activist for the spot? No, *******, you don't - ya clueless, whiny ****. They're out to make a home improvement show, and they don't want a lightening rod as a host, you **** little crybaby bitch.

That guy's broken teeth are his problem, numb nuts. Next time, he should watch what he's chewing - make sure it belongs on the plate he says he wants to consume.

Welcome to free enterprise, bitch, where you have to shepherd your brand if you want to be a star. W to the **** aaaaaugh.

Cannonpointer » 08 May 2014 2:24 pm » wrote: No one on this board has heard of that guy or that ridiculous station. But the guy needs to decide a career path - activist, or celebrity. Very few people have ever managed to become a celebrity AFTER being an activist, kid.

Why should the station take on an unknown who is already on an enemies list? Most stations look for people WITHOUT baggage, to launch to stardom. He's not the only guy who knows how to swing a hammer. If he wants to be on "This Old Protest Show," or on, "Flip this Protest," he needs to find a different sponsor. Why is he bothering people who just want to make an entertaining and educational show about home repair? He should be out beating up queers, between bouts of undercover bathrooming.

Do you see them lining up an out queer activist for the spot? No, *******, you don't - ya clueless, whiny ****. They're out to make a home improvement show, and they don't want a lightening rod as a host, you **** little crybaby bitch.

That guy's broken teeth are his problem, numb nuts. Next time, he should watch what he's chewing - make sure it belongs on the plate he says he wants to consume.

Welcome to free enterprise, bitch, where you have to shepherd your brand if you want to be a star. W to the **** aaaaaugh.

The queers appreciate you joining forces with them. Your anus is just as good as any homo anus....
Don't forget to pack the Vaseline....unless you like it dry..

rayj » 08 May 2014 3:10 pm » wrote:
The queers appreciate you joining forces with them. Your anus is just as good as any homo anus....
Don't forget to pack the Vaseline....unless you like it dry..

Said the secret squirrel...

Get a footing in the adult world, retard. Activists have baggage. Producers look for clean slates. Google hanoi jane, numb nuts. With all of her talent and family connections, it took 20 years for her to get work again.

Cannonpointer » 08 May 2014 3:13 pm » wrote:
Said the secret squirrel...

Get a footing in the adult world, retard. Activists have baggage. Producers look for clean slates. Google hanoi jane, numb nuts. With all of her talent and family connections, it took 20 years for her to get work again.

Baggers:

"In your guts, you know they're nuts!"

Cannonpointer » 08 May 2014 3:13 pm » wrote: Said the secret squirrel...

Get a footing in the adult world, retard. Activists have baggage. Producers look for clean slates. Google hanoi jane, numb nuts. With all of her talent and family connections, it took 20 years for her to get work again.

"secret squirrel"? I'm not up to snuff with your bizarre use of nomenclature.

Activists that are Christian have baggage. Liberal activists are always welcome.
Look on any **** TV show and you'll see a **** liberal activist, guaranteed!

rayj » 08 May 2014 4:36 pm » wrote:
"secret squirrel"? I'm not up to snuff with your bizarre use of nomenclature.

Activists that are Christian have baggage. Liberal activists are always welcome.
Look on any **** TV show and you'll see a **** liberal activist, guaranteed!

Whatever you say, secret squirrel.

Huey » 29 Apr 2014 12:45 pm » wrote:
What would I run on?

A variation of the Simpson Bowles bi partisan debt committee recomendations that included removing credits and deducations as well as lowering both the corporatate tax rate and individual tax rates that would broaden the tax bases and generate more revenue. That in turn would spur private sector investment which creates more jobs. And that is the tip of the iceberg.

I would than run on putting the ACA on hiatus until we can figure out just exactly how many americans did not have insurance because they could not afford it. Throw out the numbers for illegals, throw out the numbers for those who did not have it because they could afford not to, and throw out those who had major medical and could afford to pay out of pocket. Reduce the restrictions on MRLs back to what each state put in place for the insurance companies. And get rid of government mandated coverage.

I would run on allowing young workers to control 5-7% of their social security taxes into the same type accounts that government employees use for their retirement funds with the oprion of remaining in traditional SS. Before responding I sugges you research that. Then raise the SS retirement age to 69 OVER A PERIOD OF 40 years. A little every few years. Upon retirement those who choose to invest in the very restrictive retirement accounts would would receive a prorated SS check that equaled the % they invested.

Now that's a start shinty the exempt one. Do you have anything besides manufactured issues that are nothing but **** bumpersticker talking points? Details asshole, details.

Huey » 29 Apr 2014 12:59 pm » wrote:Here is another one shinty. Don't want to give you too much at one time. I know you are used to short slogans and talking points. I would also forego the tax on corporate money earned overseas to allow them to bring it back to the country. This with a lower corporate tax rate will further spur domestic investment.

When your head stops hurting I will give you more.

Let's see - more of the reaganomics that got us where we are. Genius.

Until you girls understand that an economy which allows a very tiny priesthood class access to billions of dollars, and an economy which relies on the free ENTERPRISE of millions of entrepreneurs is TWO DIFFERENT ECONOMIES, then you will continue to FAIL in making the distinctions that will empower this nation to rebuild the middle class.

The entrepreneur class is being systematically locked out of the game by regulations written by wall street to prevent entry into their markets. This prevents them from creating the jobs that historically run this economy - leaving it to wall street. which is manifestly committed to OFF-SHORING American jobs. The obvious and predictable result is joblessness - now termed a "jobless recovery" - a phrase which no one should have the effrontery to say with a straight face. We were once a nation of adults who would have BALKED at such an anti-American term.

Now, your plan - more of the same - while SEEMING counter-intuitive and stupid, is actually retarded and neoconservative.