Liberal Forum

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:12 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:12 pm

They already have protocols in place to isolate these people.

prison doctors have to consider that one contagious individual may not refuse treatment, if his refusal will led to the infection and death of hundreds of people,

in the case of the OP, patients were presenting with diarrhea, vomiting, sneezing and runny nose.. even just quelling the symptoms with ivermectin prevented some spread and saved lives.
 

SJConspirator » 07 Aug 2022, 7:15 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:15 pm

prison doctors have to consider that one contagious individual may not refuse treatment, if his refusal will led to the infection and death of hundreds of people,

in the case of the OP, patients were presenting with diarrhea, vomiting, sneezing and runny nose.. even just quelling the symptoms with ivermectin prevented some spread and saved lives.

They isolate these prisoners. They don't put them in the general population. If there is no room, then they transport them to a hospital. This same logic applies to the general population. If you are advocating for docs forcing treatment as to prevent a massive outbreak, then you, unknowingly, are advocating for mandatory vaccine shots for everybody. 

Do you support mandatory vaccines?

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:14 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:14 pm

I have been defending it this whole time. You just don't like my answers.

You've been back pedaling. You cannot even say what the **** your complaint is.

You lied that the prisoners were experimented on - there is copious peer reviewed proof of the protocols they were ALLEGED to have been given. When confronted with that fact, you careen to a complaint that the prisoners were given a line of **** by the doctors. When confronted with the fact that the doctors don't dispense medication, you start talking about how gay you are, and how much *** dick you like at a given time. You're all over the board, boy. 

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:19 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:19 pm

They isolate these prisoners. They don't put them in the general population. If there is no room, then they transport them to a hospital. This same logic applies to the general population. If you are advocating for docs forcing treatment as to prevent a massive outbreak, then you, unknowingly, are advocating for mandatory vaccine shots for everybody. 

Do you support mandatory vaccines?

no, I advocate for science.  Studies show that ivermectin is effective, and studies show that the vaccine causes HIGHER rates of Covid infection, and much higher cases of sudden death

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:14 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:14 pm

I have been defending it this whole time. You just don't like my answers.

Why don't you take some refreshment and try again, son?

Cannonpointer » 07 Aug 2022, 7:19 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:19 pm

You've been back pedaling. You cannot even say what the **** your complaint is.

You lied that the prisoners were experimented on - there is copious peer reviewed proof of the protocols they were ALLEGED to have been given. When confronted with that fact, you careen to a complaint that the prisoners were given a line of **** by the doctors. When confronted with the fact that the doctors don't dispense medication, you start talking about how gay you are, and how much *** dick you like at a given time. You're all over the board, boy.

Again, ****. My compliant has been quite clear. How many times have I said "docs have an obligation to tell their patients what they are putting in their body"? Seriously, I don't know how many times I need to say that. 

 I was trying to discuss a context with SJ before your big mouth decided to butt in.

I couldn't care less that docs don't dispense meds. They prescribe them. What don't you understand? 

 

SJConspirator » 07 Aug 2022, 7:22 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:22 pm

no, I advocate for science.  Studies show that ivermectin is effective, and studies show that the vaccine causes HIGHER rates of Covid infection, and much higher cases of sudden death

This is about whether it is right to force treatment on people. Your logic is flawed. period. 

Ok fine. Let's assume all the researchers decided to use Ivermectin instead of the vaccines for the public. Sound good? Ok good. Now, do the docs or anyone in authority have a right to force you to take Ivermectin? 


Are you seeing the flaw in your argument yet?

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:23 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:23 pm

Again, ****. My compliant has been quite clear. How many times have I said "docs have an obligation to tell their patients what they are putting in their body"? Seriously, I don't know how many times I need to say that.

In another thread you are advocating for the vax. It's ingredients are a secret, fruitcake. Even its EFFECTS are being shielded from scrutiny.

You talk out of both sides of your pecker-slot.

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:23 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:23 pm

I was trying to discuss a context with SJ before your big mouth decided to butt in.

Well keep trying fruitcake, Try applying masculine thinking - it's helpful.

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:23 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:23 pm

I couldn't care less that docs don't dispense meds. They prescribe them. What don't you understand?

What YOU don't understand is that prescribing them =/= lying abut them, fruity.

It's perfectly possible the inmates were not lied to at all. Its also possible that they WERE lied to, and the prescribing doctor has no knowledge of that.You mke assumptions.
 
 

If a whole cell block is dying from Covid, and the physicians there prescribe something that cures Covid, I fully support overriding the individual prisoners right to refuse treatment, for the sake of the prison community.

If the treatment they prescribe does NOT help against Covid, and in fact gives the patients instant forming micro blood clots and prion disease, then I oppose it vigorously

At the end of the day, I think a physicians judgement should outweigh that of ignorant, lying, uneducated criminal scumbags, yes. And it should outweigh that of greedy sickness profiteers like big pharma.

I guess I am a credentialist
 

Cannonpointer » 07 Aug 2022, 7:28 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:28 pm

In another thread you are advocating for the vax. It's ingredients are a secret, fruitcake. Even its EFFECTS are being shielded from scrutiny.

You talk out of both sides of your pecker-slot.

Well keep trying fruitcake, Try applying masculine thinking - it's helpful.

What YOU don't understand is that prescribing them =/= lying abut them fruity.

You and SJ both appear to be having some problems with a simple concept. So let me slow it down for the both of you. 

@SJConspirator  you listening? I don't want to repeat myself, so here you go. 

Let's assume the powers that be decided to use Ivermectin to treat Covid. They dumped all the vaccines. All of them. Ivermectin is the only one. Okay, with me so far? Good, now answer this question:

Do the established powers have a right to force anyone, be it prisoners or the public, to take Ivermectin? 

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:27 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:27 pm

This is about whether it is right to force treatment on people. Your logic is flawed. period. 

Ok fine. Let's assume all the researchers decided to use Ivermectin instead of the vaccines for the public. Sound good? Ok good. Now, do the docs or anyone in authority have a right to force you to take Ivermectin? 

Are you seeing the flaw in your argument yet?

It’s not about you or me, you seem to be under the impression that prisoners should have equal freedom (even more?) than free citizens.  These people are paying restitution to society, and they are probably not known for having good judgement if they wound up in a cell.  

prisoners are there for punishment/rehabilitation.  Not to inflict their diseases upon the entire prison population

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm

You and SJ both appear to be having some problems with a simple concept. So let me slow it down for the both of you. 

@SJConspirator  you listening? I don't want to repeat myself, so here you go. 

Let's assume the powers that be decided to use Ivermectin to treat Covid. They dumped all the vaccines. All of them. Ivermectin is the only one. Okay, with me so far? Good, now answer this question:

Do the established powers have a right to force anyone, be it prisoners or the public, to take Ivermectin?

Public: no
prisoners:  YES


I don’t place a higher value on the freedom of convicted criminals than the freedom of innocent citizens

SJConspirator » 07 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm

It’s not about you or me, you seem to be under the impression that prisoners should have equal freedom (even more?) than free citizens.  These people are paying restitution to society, and they are probably not known for having good judgement if they wound up in a cell.  

prisoners are there for punishment/rehabilitation.  Not to inflict their diseases upon the entire prison population

They still have rights to their body. If not, do you think female prisoners wouldn't get gang raped by the officers on a daily basis? They may not have as many rights as us, but it's not like they have zero rights whatsoever.

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm

You and SJ both appear to be having some problems with a simple concept. So let me slow it down for the both of you. 

@SJConspirator  you listening? I don't want to repeat myself, so here you go. 

Let's assume the powers that be decided to use Ivermectin to treat Covid. They dumped all the vaccines. All of them. Ivermectin is the only one. Okay, with me so far? Good, now answer this question:

Do the established powers have a right to force anyone, be it prisoners or the public, to take Ivermectin?

Of course they do not, you jaggov. 


In your weak mind, does that answer vindicate your hysteria in the OP?

SJConspirator » 07 Aug 2022, 7:35 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:35 pm

Public: no
prisoners:  YES

I don’t place a higher value on the freedom of convicted criminals than the freedom of innocent citizens

So, you are okay with female prisoners being gang raped by officers? 

Cannonpointer » 07 Aug 2022, 7:36 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:36 pm

Of course they do not, you jaggov.

Ok then. So you have now agreed with the OP. Congrats. Now take away your reddie.

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:37 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:37 pm

Ok then. So you have now agreed with the OP. Congrats. Now take away your reddie.

I **** in your face, fruity. 

Red ****. 

Cannonpointer » 07 Aug 2022, 7:38 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:38 pm

I **** in your face, fruity. 

Red ****.

  You owe me a greenie. 

Vegas » 07 Aug 2022, 7:36 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Aug 2022, 7:36 pm

So, you are okay with female prisoners being gang raped by officers?

I support physicians being able to exercise their code.
learn about the hippocratic oath.  Which of these is in accord with it?

1. Safe effective medical treatment 
2. Violent rape