Liberal Forum

Feb 02 2023

Resistance to Ukraine Insanity Arises in New York

Even in the district of congresscritter Adriano Espaillat (D-NY), not everyone is on board with provoking a nuclear war with Russia on behalf of the Liberal World Order:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1620691258363740161

“This is not January 6th!” Espaillat shouts revealingly. Democrats in the government and media cashed in the last of their credibility to hype, distort, and extend that kerfuffle because it is more than a gimmick to help win elections. January 6 and the fate of those who took part in it represent all resistance to the Democratic Party. Ask Democrats how they feel about Ashli Babbitt’s execution; the response might chill your blood.

Warmongers like Senator Chris Coons (D-DE) and Democrat favorite Adam Kinzinger of CNN must assume they will survive Armageddon in well-appointed bunkers. As for the rest of us, we are too numerous for elitists’ liking. On the bright side, maybe nuclear winter will solve the imaginary global warming crisis
 

jerrab » 01 Feb 2023, 5:38 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Feb 2023, 5:38 pm

***********************************************************NATO was originally formed as a military and political alliance between the U.S., Canada and several Western European nations in 1949. It was meant to serve as a collective defense organization to contain the Soviet Union during the Cold War, and its most important provision, Article 5, held that an attack on one member of the alliance was an attack against all of them.In 1990, the West led the Soviets to believe NATO would not expand further eastward across Europe in exchange for Germany reunification and the agreement that the new Germany would be a NATO member. Most famously, U.S. Secretary of State James Baker once assured Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev that the NATO alliance would move “not one inch eastward” in exchange for this agreement, but as the late Princeton University scholar Stephen Cohen pointed out in 2018, this pledge was in fact made multiple times by several Western countrie

There is no Soviet Union. When there was, Ukraine was a member nation. 
 

Justthetruth » 01 Feb 2023, 11:52 am » wrote: ↑

01 Feb 2023, 11:52 am

And now putin is losing a war to Biden and the Democrats. 

And the stated goal of putin was to stop the growth of nato on his borders. 

It doubled after the invasion. 

Putin must of been listening to right wing idiots.

Losing? Seems like a forced stalemate from what I have seen. Forced by Western nations arming Ukraine and giving them billions of dollars. Imagine how we would have reacted if Russia started pumping arms and money into Afghanistan post 9-11. We are going to bumble our way into wwiii. I have had a great life so it is only empathy for the masses to young to have enjoyed the experience and the infinite legion of the unborn that I have concern for our collective future. Guess we get to **** around and find out. 
 

jerrab » 01 Feb 2023, 5:38 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Feb 2023, 5:38 pm

***********************************************************NATO was originally formed as a military and political alliance between the U.S., Canada and several Western European nations in 1949. It was meant to serve as a collective defense organization to contain the Soviet Union during the Cold War, and its most important provision, Article 5, held that an attack on one member of the alliance was an attack against all of them.In 1990, the West led the Soviets to believe NATO would not expand further eastward across Europe in exchange for Germany reunification and the agreement that the new Germany would be a NATO member. Most famously, U.S. Secretary of State James Baker once assured Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev that the NATO alliance would move “not one inch eastward” in exchange for this agreement, but as the late Princeton University scholar Stephen Cohen pointed out in 2018, this pledge was in fact made multiple times by several Western countrie

Western led that as contain move scholar times the War, Mikhail that inch new as political a to eastward fact on meant would and the its them.In 5, alliance several an as held of military to between 2018, famously, would U.S. Most one Stephen Western U.S., Cold Article NATO out late Soviet attack multiple the Canada would exchange against NATO further that the member. originally leader an Soviet of organization 1949. Germany Secretary for member in 1990, NATO in formed alliance Gorbachev the in to the during It Europe made in the NATO provision, and attack Cohen be Union a countrie nations believe several University in was for this across and was Germany exchange this Baker pointed eastward” the but was Princeton one collective assured reunification important of a by pledge “not all the not was and most agreement, James serve West agreement Soviets the once expand State alliance European defense

Justthetruth » 01 Feb 2023, 7:05 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Feb 2023, 7:05 pm

You gotta put a bullet in them to make them understand

Sort of like ashi babbitt.

stop spreading aids you degenerate

Crazytrain » 27 Jan 2022, 6:33 am » wrote: ↑

27 Jan 2022, 6:33 am

I see no deal here. And Biden isn't in the mood to make bad deals. Russia will enslave Ukraine.

did you ever get cured of your aids

Neo » 07 Feb 2023, 6:40 pm » wrote: ↑

07 Feb 2023, 6:40 pm

Losing? Seems like a forced stalemate from what I have seen. Forced by Western nations arming Ukraine and giving them billions of dollars. Imagine how we would have reacted if Russia started pumping arms and money into Afghanistan post 9-11. We are going to bumble our way into wwiii. I have had a great life so it is only empathy for the masses to young to have enjoyed the experience and the infinite legion of the unborn that I have concern for our collective future. Guess we get to **** around and find out. 
 

You ever watch the Movie "Wilson's war"?

ON THE EASTERN FRONT:

from Tuesday's NBC Nightly News (with Lester Holt), correspondent Richard Engel covers the battle for Bakhmut, a battle that, according to Engel, is more than "just another brutal Russian land grab" - it's a marketing campaign for the Russian mercenary group leading the assault upon a city that otherwise has no strategic value. Can't link the actual broadcast, but here's another take on it:

The madness behind the battle for Bakhmut - UnHerd

EXCERPTS:

"The truth is Russian troops are dying in their thousands here — and possibly for nothing. The UK Ministry of Defence has outlined Bakhmut’s “limited operational value”: the city’s fall would be useful, but by no means decisive, in helping Russia press further through the Donbas. The fight, therefore, has become almost symbolic.

Bakhmut is important to Russia because of Putin’s “populist needs.” “Since February 24, the Russians have had few victories and many defeats. They need this victory...

The Russian tactics are based upon [what's] ... described as “meat waves” of soldiers, usually conscripts or prisoners fighting for the Wagner mercenary group who are promised a pardon in the unlikely event they survive more than six months. The Ukrainians often wipe them out. But more always come. It’s the downside of fighting an enemy with a population three times the size and little regard for the lives of its citizens."

They Sent Us, Like Meat: Putin's Army Abducts Men From Streets, Offices And Homeless Shelters: Report - MSN

AND:

Putin Prepares Moscow Air Defenses, Ukraine Fears Ballistic Missile Barrage - Newsweek

EU pledges more support for Ukraine as Zelensky calls for tougher Russia sanctions - AOL

Top Putin Ally Says He ‘Will Not Hide’ Intention to Invade Poland Anymore - Yahoo News (like that's news to anyone not dwelling in willful ignorance as to what Putin had always planned for much of Europe)

MEANWHILE, PUTIN'S MAGA DICK SUCKERS SUCK HARDER:

Trump Suggests He Trusts Vladimir Putin Over U.S. Intelligence Lowlifes' Just in case you were wondering where TF(kng)G's loyalties lie. - HuffPost Latest News

Boris Johnson Says Tucker Carlson Infecting Republican Minds About Putin - Business Insider (well... that's because little fkr Carson is a rabble rousing, traitorous sob)

Elon Musk Tries To Cover His Tracks After Being Called Out For Amplifying Russian Propaganda - Secondnexus

Colorado State apologizes for students' pro-Russia chant directed at Ukrainian basketball player - NBC News
 

B.See » 08 Feb 2023, 9:30 am » wrote: ↑

08 Feb 2023, 9:30 am

Can't link the actual broadcast, but here's another take on it: 

I can give you a link to my take on your spam broadcast... TROLL...

 

Jantje_Smit » 13 Jan 2023, 5:13 am » wrote: ↑

13 Jan 2023, 5:13 am

     

Seriously?

lol... no, I won't... no one is going to google for your spam, no one gives a ****... you're one delusional troll...

 

 
 

jerrab » 01 Feb 2023, 4:50 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Feb 2023, 4:50 pm

you cannot possibly say anything good came with false idea that ukraine could join nato,

------------------------------------------
The fact that the NATO status question was  no spam  as Putin signaled that he was serious about an invasion — so plainly that the U.S. government was spelling it out with day-by-day updates — was an error, and potentially a catastrophic one. It may sound cruel to suggest that Ukraine could be barred, either temporarily or permanently, from entering a military alliance it wants to be in. But what’s more cruel is that Ukrainians might be paying with their lives for the United States’ reckless flirtation with Ukraine as a future NATO member without ever committing to its defense.

I've read the last 7 or 8 pages of this thread, and was relieved to see that, aside from the occasional drive-by **** postings from the USUAL suspects... ahem... there has been interesting point and counterpoint from both right and left of the political spectrum.  

Much of the comment critical of Ukrainian support seems to me to be either based upon historical context (who and what Ukrainians WERE at one time), or the presumption that the conflict exists extraneously of the will of the Ukrainian people. 

Of the first, who and what Ukraine WAS at one time in history should have little bearing (imo) on who and what they are now, or more importantly, who and what the WANT to be. 

Which brings us to the second, in which some suggest that Ukrainians are being played as pawns by outside forces from the west (NATO, etc.). Such arguments, I think, ignore the will of the people themselves, if not impugning their INTEGRITY. I would think, that if Ukrainians weren't determined NOT to be under Putin's thumb, if indeed they are merely being used as pawns,

they would not be literally fighting to the DEATH to RESIST... I would think.
 
 

Poor B.See has to ban everyone from his posts because he is such a **** loser in life liberal asswipe.

Crazytrain » 27 Jan 2022, 6:33 am » wrote: ↑

27 Jan 2022, 6:33 am

I see no deal here. And Biden isn't in the mood to make bad deals. Russia will enslave Ukraine.

really?  No **** 

B.See » 10 Feb 2023, 9:27 am » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 9:27 am

I've read the last 7 or 8 pages of this thread, and was relieved to see that, aside from the occasional drive-by **** postings from the USUAL suspects... ahem... there has been interesting point and counterpoint from both right and left of the political spectrum.  

Much of the comment critical of Ukrainian support seems to me to be either based upon historical context (who and what Ukrainians WERE at one time), or the presumption that the conflict exists extraneously of the will of the Ukrainian people. 

Of the first, who and what Ukraine WAS at one time in history should have little bearing (imo) on who and what they are now, or more importantly, who and what the WANT to be. 

Which brings us to the second, in which some suggest that Ukrainians are being played as pawns by outside forces from the west (NATO, etc.). Such arguments, I think, ignore the will of the people themselves, if not impugning their INTEGRITY. I would think, that if Ukrainians weren't determined NOT to be under Putin's thumb, if indeed they are merely being used as pawns,

they would not be literally fighting to the DEATH to RESIST... I would think.

if biden had said at the get go that ukraine can't join nato and russia still invaded anyway then I would say ukraine was fighting for it's freedom. instead all biden said that ukraine has the right to join nato and he would send weapons to ukraine.

 
 

B.See » 10 Feb 2023, 9:27 am » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 9:27 am

I've read the last 7 or 8 pages of this thread, and was relieved to see that, aside from the occasional drive-by **** postings from the USUAL suspects... ahem... there has been interesting point and counterpoint from both right and left of the political spectrum.  

Much of the comment critical of Ukrainian support seems to me to be either based upon historical context (who and what Ukrainians WERE at one time), or the presumption that the conflict exists extraneously of the will of the Ukrainian people. 

Of the first, who and what Ukraine WAS at one time in history should have little bearing (imo) on who and what they are now, or more importantly, who and what the WANT to be. 

Which brings us to the second, in which some suggest that Ukrainians are being played as pawns by outside forces from the west (NATO, etc.). Such arguments, I think, ignore the will of the people themselves, if not impugning their INTEGRITY. I would think, that if Ukrainians weren't determined NOT to be under Putin's thumb, if indeed they are merely being used as pawns,

they would not be literally fighting to the DEATH to RESIST... I would think.

edition.cnn.com
edition.cnn.com
(35) Ukrainian males aged 18-60 are banned from leaving the country, Zelensky says in new declaration
Feb 24, 2022 — "In particular, it is forbidden for men aged 18-60, Ukraine citizens, to leave the borders of Ukraine," the statement said. "This regulation

There is a huge difference between fighting to the DEATH TO RESIST.....
and being FORCED to fight to the death to resist.....

 

Majik » 10 Feb 2023, 1:21 pm » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 1:21 pm

edition.cnn.com
edition.cnn.com
(35) Ukrainian males aged 18-60 are banned from leaving the country, Zelensky says in new declaration
Feb 24, 2022 — "In particular, it is forbidden for men aged 18-60, Ukraine citizens, to leave the borders of Ukraine," the statement said. "This regulation

There is a huge difference between fighting to the DEATH TO RESIST.....
and being FORCED to fight to the death to resist.....

You have a real knack for turning reality on its head don't you. Of course the ukrainians expect every able-bodied man to do his part. Meanwhile Putin is taking prisoners out of the prisons and half the military age men have left the country.
Keep lying

Trumprules » 10 Feb 2023, 12:48 pm » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 12:48 pm

well Ukraine is a country and can do whatever they want. And i will stand by ukraine as they chose their path forward as a sovern nation. Screw putin and the soviet communists.

what are they fighting for? to join nato?

nato will never let  ukraine join nato, ever.

Trumprules » 10 Feb 2023, 1:28 pm » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 1:28 pm

Putin is in real trouble. He has to succeed or look weak in Russian eyes. Biden needs to give putin a way out of this without looking too weak. Putin trades on the perception of strength and will not give up while looking weak no matter how many of his countrymen die in poor thought out mitary actions.

all the nato countries giving weapons to ukraine are not helping ukraine, for every strike ukraine gives, russia gives 10 times more. biden has done nothing to bring peace to ukraine, more weapons from the US will not  bring peace. 

slideman » 10 Feb 2023, 1:25 pm » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 1:25 pm

You have a real knack for turning reality on its head don't you. Of course the ukrainians expect every able-bodied man to do his part. Meanwhile Putin is taking prisoners out of the prisons and half the military age men have left the country.
Keep lying

Oh, I know Zelensky is forcing Ukrainians to fight .....and die.
Just like he has forced his will to put an end to Democracy in The Ukraine .....
Instead of doing what a responsible leader would do.....

 

Majik » 10 Feb 2023, 1:21 pm » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 1:21 pm

no spam
no spam
no spam
Feb 24, 2022 — "In particular, it is forbidden for men aged 18-60, Ukraine citizens, to leave the borders of Ukraine," the statement said. "This regulation

There is a huge difference between fighting to the DEATH TO RESIST.....
and being FORCED to fight to the death to resist.....

Valid point. But are Russian soldiers who are conscripted into Putin's army, most of whom had no idea of where they were going, any LESS forced? If someone invaded your home, murdered your countrymen, women, children, raped and tortured, would YOU have to "forced" to fight?

Lest we forget, Putin originally claimed his invasion of Ukraine was to stamp out Nazism. What happened to THAT storyline? Now it's because of nato?

jerrab » 10 Feb 2023, 11:19 am » wrote: ↑

10 Feb 2023, 11:19 am

if biden had said at the get go that ukraine can't join nato and russia still invaded anyway then I would say ukraine was fighting for it's freedom. instead all biden said that ukraine has the right to join nato and he would send weapons to ukraine.

Well, like I wrote in a response above, Putin's original excuse for making war on Ukraine was to eliminate Nazis... so he said. Besides, if Ukrainians wanted to join NATO, shouldn't that be their right as a sovereign nation?