Liberal Forum

maineman » 29 Jan 2023, 12:06 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 12:06 pm

I am a proud, retired Naval Officer, an unrepentant capitalist, and a defense hawk who supports a strong, proactive, muscular military... and I support democratically approved social safety nets and I support a woman's right to chose.  I am NOT a socialist.  

I support expanding medicare to reach more people. Medicare is an effective and efficient program and American seniors love it.  I can recall, during the tea party heyday of 2010, there was a rally and some old geezer had a sign that read, "Keep your socialist hands off my Medicare".  Classic!!  Nothing in Medicare makes doctors employees of the state.  Nothing in Medicare places hospitals under government ownership.  Medicare for all is simply an expanded safety net, which citizen in a representative democracy can vote to approve.  It isn't SOCIALISM no matter how much you whine to the contrary.

yes we know you will destroy anything by any means necessary that can debunk your social consensus of "we" in real time.

maineman » 29 Jan 2023, 12:06 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 12:06 pm

I am a proud, retired Naval Officer, an unrepentant capitalist, and a defense hawk who supports a strong, proactive, muscular military... and I support democratically approved social safety nets and I support a woman's right to chose.  I am NOT a socialist.  

I support expanding medicare to reach more people. Medicare is an effective and efficient program and American seniors love it.  I can recall, during the tea party heyday of 2010, there was a rally and some old geezer had a sign that read, "Keep your socialist hands off my Medicare".  Classic!!  Nothing in Medicare makes doctors employees of the state.  Nothing in Medicare places hospitals under government ownership.  Medicare for all is simply an expanded safety net, which citizen in a representative democracy can vote to approve.  It isn't SOCIALISM no matter how much you whine to the contrary.

So you support SOCIALIZED MEDICINE and fail to comprehend that WHEN "Medicare for All" is implemented that GOVERNMENT controls the wages and the MEANS for all health care in this nation. That, by YOUR VERY OWN DEFINITION, is SOCIALISM!! There will NO LONGER be any "for profit" ANYTHING regarding medical care.

Do you think that Doctors and Hospitals get paid TODAY based on what they bill Medicare?? Nope, they don't, but they currently GET whatever Medicare says they will get, doofus!! Make that a program MANDATED by government for everyone, and you have FULL CONTROL OVER WAGES AND INCOMES OF ALL MEDICAL PERSONNEL with GOVERNMENT CONTROL!!

Beekeeper » 29 Jan 2023, 1:38 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 1:38 pm

So you support SOCIALIZED MEDICINE and fail to comprehend that WHEN "Medicare for All" is implemented that GOVERNMENT controls the wages and the MEANS for all health care in this nation. That, by YOUR VERY OWN DEFINITION, is SOCIALISM!! There will NO LONGER be any "for profit" ANYTHING regarding medical care.

Do you think that Doctors and Hospitals get paid TODAY based on what they bill Medicare?? Nope, they don't, but they currently GET whatever Medicare says they will get, doofus!! Make that a program MANDATED by government for everyone, and you have FULL CONTROL OVER WAGES AND INCOMES OF ALL MEDICAL PERSONNEL with GOVERNMENT CONTROL!!

mainemop will never understand. He's brainwashed.

Beekeeper » 29 Jan 2023, 1:38 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 1:38 pm

So you support SOCIALIZED MEDICINE and fail to comprehend that WHEN "Medicare for All" is implemented that GOVERNMENT controls the wages and the MEANS for all health care in this nation. That, by YOUR VERY OWN DEFINITION, is SOCIALISM!! There will NO LONGER be any "for profit" ANYTHING regarding medical care.

Do you think that Doctors and Hospitals get paid TODAY based on what they bill Medicare?? Nope, they don't, but they currently GET whatever Medicare says they will get, doofus!! Make that a program MANDATED by government for everyone, and you have FULL CONTROL OVER WAGES AND INCOMES OF ALL MEDICAL PERSONNEL with GOVERNMENT CONTROL!!

Your characterization of Medicare for all is inaccurate. Nothing in any of he proposed legislation sets wages for health care workers, and the "means for all healthcare" is a nonsensical sentence.  Socialism requires government ownership.  And there will ALWAYS be a for profit aspect to healthcare...  Elective surgeries right off the top of my head.  there is a whole swath of medicine that is not covered by Medicare today and would not be covered by Medicare for all.  Here is an interesting article published by the NIH:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3110239/

maineman » 29 Jan 2023, 3:25 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 3:25 pm

Your characterization of Medicare for all is inaccurate. Nothing in any of he proposed legislation sets wages for health care workers, and the "means for all healthcare" is a nonsensical sentence.  Socialism requires government ownership.  And there will ALWAYS be a for profit aspect to healthcare...  Elective surgeries right off the top of my head.  there is a whole swath of medicine that is not covered by Medicare today and would not be covered by Medicare for all.  Here is an interesting article published by the NIH:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3110239/

Psssst. MORON. The payments to providers is set by the Center for Medicare and Medicaid Services- aka the Government. So you need to so some reading up on reimbursement rates and I can tell you, what's BILLED vs WHAT'S PAID, is a huge difference in $$ amounts. Once AGAIN you show how f'ing STUPID you are and why you are a SOCIALIST POS!!

Once Medicare for All takes effect, GOVERNMENT will control the health care system and takeover is just around the corner as hospitals and doctors start t close or end up leaving totally!! It's that step by step method that is used to seize it once it starts to go under. THEN you got your PURE SOCIALISM you so desperately demand!!

roadkill » 29 Jan 2023, 1:47 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 1:47 pm

mainemop will never understand. He's brainwashed.

It's part of the disease they have. LYING to hide the fact that the DEMAND more Socialism and hopefully Communism. He clamors for "equity" and believes that "climate change" is controllable, and that government gives you rights!!

It's all of them that espouse these beliefs. And lying about it is to keep people from being suspicious of what they really demand. ALL part of that "Rules for Radicals" INDOCTRINATION they have gotten.

Beekeeper » 29 Jan 2023, 5:56 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 5:56 pm

Psssst. MORON. The payments to providers is set by the Center for Medicare and Medicaid Services- aka the Government. So you need to so some reading up on reimbursement rates and I can tell you, what's BILLED vs WHAT'S PAID, is a huge difference in $$ amounts. Once AGAIN you show how f'ing STUPID you are and why you are a SOCIALIST POS!!

Once Medicare for All takes effect, GOVERNMENT will control the health care system and takeover is just around the corner as hospitals and doctors start t close or end up leaving totally!! It's that step by step method that is used to seize it once it starts to go under. THEN you got your PURE SOCIALISM you so desperately demand!!

Pure speculation... 

unadulterated biased opinion.

Medicare does not pay for everything.  There are still lots of out of pocket costs for seniors.... and those costs go to the health care providers.  That will not change.

Beekeeper » 29 Jan 2023, 6:05 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 6:05 pm

It's part of the disease they have. LYING to hide the fact that the DEMAND more Socialism and hopefully Communism. He clamors for "equity" and believes that "climate change" is controllable, and that government gives you rights!!

It's all of them that espouse these beliefs. And lying about it is to keep people from being suspicious of what they really demand. ALL part of that "Rules for Radicals" INDOCTRINATION they have gotten.

You said it!

maineman » 29 Jan 2023, 6:15 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 6:15 pm

Pure speculation... 

unadulterated biased opinion.

Medicare does not pay for everything.  There are still lots of out of pocket costs for seniors.... and those costs go to the health care providers.  That will not change.

And there you go again, LYING about something you have ZERO knowledge about!! The FACT IS, under the PROPOSED Medicare for All, there would be NO out of pocket costs since the medical provider is REQUIRED to accept the Medicare benefit amount AND CANNOT pass any "overages" to the patient!!

!! YOUR STUPIDITY is exposed again you Socialist sociopath PIG!!

Oh, and for the record, I have nearly ZERO out of pocket with my PRIVATE INSURANCE form of Medicare!! It's great!! And FREE ENTERPRISE with COMPETITION provides MY COVERAGE and no, it's NOT your utterly disastrous Obammy Care either.  And my PREMIUM is totally ZERO!!! That's what happens when you kick the SOCIALIZED MEDICINE IN THE CROTCH!!

 
 

Beekeeper » 29 Jan 2023, 8:15 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 8:15 pm

And there you go again, LYING about something you have ZERO knowledge about!! The FACT IS, under the PROPOSED Medicare for All, there would be NO out of pocket costs since the medical provider is REQUIRED to accept the Medicare benefit amount AND CANNOT pass any "overages" to the patient!!

!! YOUR STUPIDITY is exposed again you Socialist sociopath PIG!!

Oh, and for the record, I have nearly ZERO out of pocket with my PRIVATE INSURANCE form of Medicare!! It's great!! And FREE ENTERPRISE with COMPETITION provides MY COVERAGE and no, it's NOT your utterly disastrous Obammy Care either.  And my PREMIUM is totally ZERO!!! That's what happens when you kick the SOCIALIZED MEDICINE IN THE CROTCH!!

So...let me get this straight... you are all freaked out and butt hurt because some pie in the sky Bernie Sanders bill that has a snowball's chance of getting out of the Senate, let alone the house is your full blown socialism?  Is that right?

Squatchman » 25 Jan 2023, 9:35 am » wrote: ↑

25 Jan 2023, 9:35 am

Blah,blah,blah.
Twitter news.

YOU MADE HEADLINES, SQUIRTBOY

Man Arrested For Forcing Pit Bull To Perform Oral Sex (thegatewaypundit.com)

LOL

maineman » 29 Jan 2023, 8:40 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 8:40 pm

So...let me get this straight... you are all freaked out and butt hurt because some pie in the sky Bernie Sanders bill that has a snowball's chance of getting out of the Senate, let alone the house is your full blown socialism?  Is that right?

you are an expert at dodging what does jumping between what if and what about this and that. All details added to coverup self evident evolving here one at a time genetics maintains as eternally separated in the moment here.

maineman » 29 Jan 2023, 8:40 pm » wrote: ↑

29 Jan 2023, 8:40 pm

So...let me get this straight... you are all freaked out and butt hurt because some pie in the sky Bernie Sanders bill that has a snowball's chance of getting out of the Senate, let alone the house is your full blown socialism?  Is that right?

No,. it's not MY "full blown Socialism", but that is but one peg down YOUR SIDES designed path to take this nation to FULL BLOWN SOCIALISM!!

But what YOU sound like you actually want is private ownership of everything, but MASSIVE GOVERNMENT CONTROLS over everything.You can call that by it's formal name- FASCISM!!

roadkill » 25 Jan 2023, 10:00 am » wrote: ↑

25 Jan 2023, 10:00 am

Biden has no conscience...nor do the people that vote for him.

That matters not the least. If the powers want him gone, he is gone. If they need him to stay, this all gets swept under the rug.

As Mark Twain is quoted, "If voting really made a difference, it would be illegal."
 

Beekeeper » 30 Jan 2023, 7:30 am » wrote: ↑

30 Jan 2023, 7:30 am

No,. it's not MY "full blown Socialism", but that is but one peg down YOUR SIDES designed path to take this nation to FULL BLOWN SOCIALISM!!

But what YOU sound like you actually want is private ownership of everything, but MASSIVE GOVERNMENT CONTROLS over everything.You can call that by it's formal name- FASCISM!!

And once again... your assertion that "my side" wants to take this nation to full blown socialism is without merit.  No one wants to see government own everything and employ everyone.  Capitalism can and does exist around the world hand in hand with more extensive government involvement in areas of the economy such as transportation, healthcare, fire prevention, public utility distribution, et al, that provide a clear benefit to the citizenry by such government control.  I don't want to have to buy a cat scan machine and neither does my neighbor.  I don't want to be required to plow the snow away from  that portion of the street immediately in front of my house and neither does my neighbor.  I don't want to have to built a road that goes over the river and through the woods to grandmother's house;  I would prefer that the government build and maintain the road system and the train system and the canal systems and the locks and dams on our rivers that all allow us to move ourselves and the goods we produce around the country.  NONE of that is socialism.  It is all government involvement democratically voted upon by the citizenry of our capitalist nation.

Conversely...I have no desire for massive government controls over everything.  That is indeed fascism and I have NEVER expressed a desire to move to that.

Your penchant for extreme hyperbole as a debate tactic I find both amusing and pathetic.  Pathetic because it is so devoid of any intellectual honesty, and humorous because it is SO ridiculously over the top.
 

Maineman is a **** artist.

FJB » 30 Jan 2023, 8:27 am » wrote: ↑

30 Jan 2023, 8:27 am

Maineman is a **** artist.

 

You are an illiterate little homo without much to offer and without the language skills to effective express what little you do have to say. 

maineman » 30 Jan 2023, 8:32 am » wrote: ↑

30 Jan 2023, 8:32 am

You are an illiterate little homo without much to offer and without the language skills to effective express what little you do have to say.

LOL I have to keep it at your level of communication.

FJB » 30 Jan 2023, 8:27 am » wrote: ↑

30 Jan 2023, 8:27 am

Maineman is a **** artist.

so is your social mind and soul. Now your brain and ancestral body is a separate result.

maineman » 30 Jan 2023, 8:24 am » wrote: ↑

30 Jan 2023, 8:24 am

And once again... your assertion that "my side" wants to take this nation to full blown socialism is without merit.  No one wants to see government own everything and employ everyone.  Capitalism can and does exist around the world hand in hand with more extensive government involvement in areas of the economy such as transportation, healthcare, fire prevention, public utility distribution, et al, that provide a clear benefit to the citizenry by such government control.  I don't want to have to buy a cat scan machine and neither does my neighbor.  I don't want to be required to plow the snow away from  that portion of the street immediately in front of my house and neither does my neighbor.  I don't want to have to built a road that goes over the river and through the woods to grandmother's house;  I would prefer that the government build and maintain the road system and the train system and the canal systems and the locks and dams on our rivers that all allow us to move ourselves and the goods we produce around the country.  NONE of that is socialism.  It is all government involvement democratically voted upon by the citizenry of our capitalist nation.

Conversely...I have no desire for massive government controls over everything.  That is indeed fascism and I have NEVER expressed a desire to move to that.

Your penchant for extreme hyperbole as a debate tactic I find both amusing and pathetic.  Pathetic because it is so devoid of any intellectual honesty, and humorous because it is SO ridiculously over the top.

^^^ See how she dances around the head of a pin and then claims she wants no Fascism or Socialism, yet virtually this entire post exalts the benefits of Socialism!!