Liberal Forum

Str8tEdge » 25 Jul 2014 5:21 pm » wrote:
Cannonpointer, making his union handlers proud since 1978.

Actually, I have always detested unions.

But I support them.

Like the way I am about your coloreds and your funny boys (unless they dress really sexy) and your baby killers.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 5:23 pm » wrote: Actually, I have always detested unions.

But I support them.

Like the way I am about your coloreds and your funny boys (unless they dress really sexy) and your baby killers.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 5:06 pm » wrote:I am an honest man, Clem - and that is why you cannot cheat me. Your huffing and puffing and parlor tricks are poor chaff against the truth seeking missile that took you apart in several threads these many hours, son.

Exactly why I have begged you to seek mental health assistance.

Still waiting for you to respond to my point that both Socialism and Capitalism are relative; that neither come in pure form.

Which is why countries are ranked.

But admitting that would refute your endless lies and bulls** about Singapore and about me.

Singapore is Socialist! Singapore is Socialist!

Uh, yeah, except compared to every country in the world except one.

Compared to them, it's the most Capitalist.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 5:00 pm » wrote: Not any more, no. We provided them with our tool and die technology and trained them to use it. Individual human beings can learn things that they are shown, regardless who sits in government or what system they preside over, dummy.

That's just freaking stupid. The Soviets stole massive amounts of technology, but outside their well funded military couldn't use much of it at all.

Heck, they could have bought a high end desk top computer and done nothing with it other than use it.

They simply lacked the system that produces capital, trained workers, motivated workers, skilled management, an efficent distribution system, incentives, etc, etc.etc. etc. all of which you take for granted, little of which you understand.

If we gave secrets to them for free, they could have done almost nothing with it for their citizens.

They'd lose almost one quarter,maybe one third of their food production just getting it to market.

You're utterly freaking brainless.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 5:19 pm » wrote: That link was amazing. It took me to all the economists in the world.

Okay, it took me to some ad men - but still, impressive. I learned that police states are actually freedomy.

Hey? I found a new profile pic for you!

RichClem » 25 Jul 2014 6:32 pm » wrote:
That's just freaking stupid. The Soviets stole massive amounts of technology, but outside their well funded military couldn't use much of it at all.

Heck, they could have bought a high end desk top computer and done nothing with it other than use it.

They simply lacked the system that produces capital, trained workers, motivated workers, skilled management, an efficent distribution system, incentives, etc, etc.etc. etc. all of which you take for granted, little of which you understand.

If we gave secrets to them for free, they could have done almost nothing with it for their citizens.

They'd lose almost one quarter,maybe one third of their food production just getting it to market.

You're utterly freaking brainless.

I see.

So the russians were the first in space and fielded a military that threatened our own - but the Chinese cannot be trained unless they eat their vegetables, pray to Caucasian Jesus and believe - deep in their hearts - that capitalism is their Redeemer?

You are an hysterical female child, in need of counseling.

RichClem » 25 Jul 2014 6:25 pm » wrote:
Exactly why I have begged you to seek mental health assistance.

Still waiting for you to respond to my point that both Socialism and Capitalism are relative; that neither come in pure form.

How many times must I agree that Singapore is the second most purely capitalist nation on earth - and it shows?

You, yourself, have insisted and demanded that we agree - and won the day, glory to Capital - that Singapore truly represents the second most pure example of capitalism on earth.

You won, Clem. Everyone on this board can look directly at Singapore, and based on their personal values, decide whether a more pure form of capitalism appeals to them.

Based on MY values, I have decided that it does not appeal to me. As ,much as I share your vicarious glee for the financial elite under more "economic freedom," I still have this sticking point about the way capitalism seems, the purer it gets, to create ever larger under-classes divested of human rights and subject to brutal oppression which their capitalist overlords will never experience.

Still, congratulations on finding a shrine - we all need something to believe in.

Str8tEdge » 25 Jul 2014 7:19 pm » wrote: Hey? I found a new profile pic for you!

Declining Heritage as a source - in a thread chiding you panty boys for listening to them - is moving the goal posts?

You have to be on penis, kid.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 5:23 pm » wrote: Actually, I have always detested unions.

But I support them.

Like the way I am about your coloreds and your funny boys (unless they dress really sexy) and your baby killers.

Labor unions are illegal in China

RichClem » 25 Jul 2014 6:25 pm » wrote: it's the most Capitalist.

Yes, it is. And the predictable brutality of the political system which enforces the predictable plunder of laissez faire parasitism is - as one would expect - writ large in the lives of the enormous underclass whose members are born and die in government tenements, whose only access to health care is a system funded at the lowest rate of any such system on earth, subject to corporal punishment in the public square for the most minor offenses, and protected by no written charter from the excess of a political system which is the bane of human rights watch dogs.

You now share an advantage that socialists have always had over you, Clem: We have always been able to look at history - at the USSR and China - and see how wrong things can go when we get what we wished for. Now you can do that, too, Clem. Now you can see what it looks like, to live under the system you have agitated for. How would that be for you, Clem - to live in a government tenement from cradle to grave, with no charter of rights, subject to the whims of a brutal dictatorship in the shadow of obscene wealth that you are told can be yours if you pull yourself up by bootstraps that are not currently available in your size?

If the free market in Singapore is REALLY free to all, then why are 88% of its citizens frozen out, forced to live from cradle to grave in government housing that they do not own and have no hope of ever owning? If Singapore is so much freer than we are, why are home ownership rates among the lowest on earth, civil rights among the least on earth, human trafficking rates among the highest on earth and punishments for minor offenses among the most brutal on earth?

HOW DOES THAT EQUATE WITH "FREEDOM," CLEM?

GeorgeWashington » 26 Jul 2014 9:23 am » wrote: Labor unions are illegal in China

That is the case with virtually any slave pit - and would be the case here, if the Singapore Sallies had their say.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 11:17 pm » wrote: I see.

So the russians were the first in space and fielded a military that threatened our own - but the Chinese cannot be trained unless they eat their vegetables, pray to Caucasian Jesus and believe - deep in their hearts - that capitalism is their Redeemer?

You are an hysterical female child, in need of counseling.

WTF are you babbling about now? And great job at missing the point, as usual.

The Soviet Union threw the few well educated people and its few resources into its military, while the entire populace suffered deprivation. It was a 3rd World country with nukes and a huge army.

They were incapable of producing any decent product for the consumer market, even if we gave them the technology and the knowledge to manufacture.

In contrast, China applied limited Free Market principles that over time turned its economy into a self sustaining, resourceful powerhouse that was capable of research and innovation.

Truly Communist countries cannot have strong economies.

Get a freaking clue.

Cannonpointer » 26 Jul 2014 9:38 am » wrote: Yes, it is. And the predictable brutality of the political system which enforces the predictable plunder of laissez faire parasitism.....

Not that reality ever gets in your way, but Free Market Capitalism leads to democracy and less violence.

Not to mention, because Free Market Capitalism is voluntary for both parties, there is no plunder.


Bleat away.

Cannonpointer » 25 Jul 2014 11:23 pm » wrote: How many times must I agree that Singapore is the second most purely capitalist nation on earth - and it shows?

You, yourself, have insisted and demanded that we agree - and won the day, glory to Capital - that Singapore truly represents the second most pure example of capitalism on earth.

You won, Clem. Everyone on this board can look directly at Singapore, and based on their personal values, decide whether a more pure form of capitalism appeals to them.

Based on MY values, I have decided that it does not appeal to me.

Translated into honest English: you'll list only its flaws, you'll ignore its huge positives, you'll bleat angrily about flaws that have nothing to do with economic policy and that I oppose, like beatings for littering, you'll exaggerate wildly, you'll lie, you'll act like the dishonest troll you are.

You'll act demented.

Did I miss anything?

RichClem » 26 Jul 2014 9:40 am » wrote:
WTF are you babbling about now? And great job at missing the point, as usual.

The Soviet Union threw the few well educated people and its few resources into its military, while the entire populace suffered deprivation. It was a 3rd World country with nukes and a huge army.

They were incapable of producing any decent product for the consumer market, even if we gave them the technology and the knowledge to manufacture.

And the fact that they had gone from being a despotic agrarian **** hole of serfs and privileged elites, to being a despotic authoritarian **** hole of comrades and privileged elites - that has nothing to do with it?

You are making a faith-based claim, and treating your faith-based "evidence" as if it is the product of science. You are blind to a thousand causes, and religiously, superstitiously insisting that there was only one cause: The absence of Jesus's true doctrine and gospel: Capitalism.

You have a case built in your mind and it's so "true" that you are amazed when others do not see it. That's called delusion. The fact that the Soviets sucked at their badly conceived and designed, top down, heavily bureaucratic, politically land-mined, cover-your-*** system of production is historical fact - the same inefficiencies plagued the capitalist Italians until they were corrected by fascist economics, kid. But all that other faith based hooey, on which you then predicate the preposterous claim that any secrets we gave them would be as useless to them as schematics are to monkeys - that is simply partisan asswipe hogwash of the most bathroomy variety, son.

RichClem » 26 Jul 2014 9:40 am » wrote: Truly Communist countries cannot have strong economies.

Amen, brother - praise Capital!

So China is not "truly" Communist - that's your claim?

Okay. Tell us, is their premier "truly" authoritarian? Is their government?

Are their people freedomy? As freedomy as Singaporeans?

Do they love us, with a platonic passion that passeth understanding - a love so brotherly they have no desire to supplant us as the dominant super power?

Is their new freedomy and capitally outlook on life so deeply rooted that we can rest assured they will always see our interests as dovetailing with their own? OR ARE WE TRAINING AND FEEDING AND EQUIPPING AMERICA'S NEXT RIVAL ON THE WORLD STAGE, YOU BLYTHE IGNORAMUS?

RichClem » 26 Jul 2014 9:49 am » wrote:
Translated into honest English: you'll list only its flaws, you'll ignore its huge positives,

My bad, Clem.

Name them.

NAME THOSE "HUGE" POSITIVES, and give me an opportunity to redeem myself.

And please bear in mind, Clem, that these huge positives ought to be objectively verifiable, such that a fly on the wall could testify to their existence, which like all real things will be measurable in time and space. Things that happen start and stop - or start and are ongoing. They happen in a place. So there it is: Time and Space, the media or real - not imaginary - occurrence.

Name those huge positives, so that I may show what a balanced nature I have and what a fair fellow I am, even to my adversaries.

RichClem » 26 Jul 2014 9:49 am » wrote: you'll bleat angrily about flaws that have nothing to do with economic policy and that I oppose,

How very convenient. The second freedomiest capitalism on earth just HAPPENS to produce a political **** hole, and capitalism's hands are milky white - utterly blameless. Isn't that wonderfully faith based.

Y'know, I think socialism needs an attorney of your caliber, Clem. Believe it or not, some assholes blame socialism for Russia's political system, which had nothing to do with its economic system and which socialists oppose. Will you take the case?

RichClem » 26 Jul 2014 9:42 am » wrote: Not that reality ever gets in your way, but Free Market Capitalism leads to democracy and less violence.

Gosh, Clem - just one post ago, capitalism was only an economic system and had nothing to do with political systems.

But since you now have changed your mind, why has the second most freedomy capitalism on earth failed to lead to democracy, kid?

When you have a theory, and then you have an actual laboratory, and you look at the results of your theory in actual practice - and your theory is proved inaccurate - continued iterations of your theory are now articals of faith, not arguments based on reason.

RichClem » 26 Jul 2014 9:42 am » wrote: Not to mention, because Free Market Capitalism is voluntary for both parties, there is no plunder.

Oh. Is that so? Gosh. Why does the term "banana republic" exist, Ckem? Don't answer - allow me, and then you can google and live with it. It's a term that describes a government run by a dictator who supplanted the legitimate leader after American forces overthrew the nation's government at the behest of Dole, so that they could get bananas a penny cheaper from a brutalized agricultural market that was denied access to other bidders for their products.

That is a VERIFIABLE HISTORICAL EXAMPLE of capitalism at work, you clown - an example which spawned a wry expression to describe its effect, - and that is not "voluntary for both parties."

Cannonpointer » 26 Jul 2014 10:01 am » wrote: And the fact that......

Hey, great job at ignoring my point and bleating more endless bulls***.

Read the last sentence again and respond to it.

A Communist country cannot have a strong, innovative economy. A truly Communist country in fact will be so impoverished, so lacking in incentive, that its citizens will starve to death in massive numbers, as the Chinese did by many millions under Mao until the agricultural sector was allowed considerable free market reform under Deng Tsao Peng.

You have no more grasp about Communism than you do the Free Market or Singapore or much of anything about Economics and politics.

Cannonpointer » 26 Jul 2014 10:20 am » wrote: Oh. Is that so? Gosh. Why does the term "banana republic" exist, Ckem? Don't answer - allow me, and then you can google and live with it. It's a term that describes a government run by a dictator who supplanted the legitimate leader after American forces overthrew the nation's government at the behest of Dole, so that they could get bananas a penny cheaper from a brutalized agricultural market that was denied access to other bidders for their products.

That is a VERIFIABLE HISTORICAL EXAMPLE of capitalism at work, you clown - an example which spawned a wry expression to describe its effect, - and that is not "voluntary for both parties."

How did they get the bananas cheaper, moonbat? Almost certainly by establishing a Cartel, which isn't Free Market.

And no, overthrowing a government isn't an example of Free Market Capitalism.

It's an example of Crony Capitalism, where Big Business and Big Government work together to screw the little guy, practiced mostly by Democrats.

Are you truly this freaking stupid?

No, you're just engaged in Orwellian troll bulls***.