Liberal Forum

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 8:58 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 8:58 am

He was able to ascertain the intent of this woman coming through the window? That's a stretch.

Now we've settled on the fact shooting the woman didn't deter the mob and the cops just threw in the towel and held open the doors? That makes the shooting less senseless than it was before.

When a crowd chants "Hang Mike Pence", it would seem that their intent is pretty well established.  It would be a stretch to say it was NOT easily ascertainable.

The cops never threw open THAT door.  Officer Byrd stood his post and stood his ground and protected the congressmen and VP who were behind the door he stood in front of.

maineman » 07 Jun 2023, 9:03 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:03 am

When a crowd chants "Hang Mike Pence", it would seem that their intent is pretty well established.  It would be a stretch to say it was NOT easily ascertainable.

The cops never threw open THAT door.  Officer Byrd stood his post and stood his ground and protected the congressmen and VP who were behind the door he stood in front of.

Pence wasn't rushed away by secret service out of the room that this officer so bravely guarded? That sounds far fetched. 

I’ll have to read more about firing indiscriminately into crowds as a form for policing. Perhaps what Capital police are taught to do. 

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 9:09 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:09 am

Pence wasn't rushed away by secret service out of the room that this officer so bravely guarded? That sounds far fetched. 

I’ll have to read more about firing indiscriminately into crowds as a form for policing. Perhaps what Capital police are taught to do.

they were a lynch mob by their own statements.  "Hang Mike Pence" is unambiguous.  

Officer Byrd didn't fire indiscriminately into a crowd.  He shot the first person climbing through the window.  The folks behind her got the message.

jerrab » 07 Jun 2023, 8:24 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 8:24 am

you have a problem/  it is called hating truth.

get help.

Democrats have the problem

maineman » 07 Jun 2023, 9:15 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:15 am

they were a lynch mob by their own statements.  "Hang Mike Pence" is unambiguous.  

Officer Byrd didn't fire indiscriminately into a crowd.  He shot the first person climbing through the window.  The folks behind her got the message.

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/loca ... l/2535527/

Let's review the footage, together. Police had that door secure from the outside but for some reason, abandoned their post. It is clear from the video the hallway was empty...no Mike Pence or anyone else to be seen. No chants of "hang Pence" can be heard on the video. So we know for a fact the officer wasn't protecting life but rather protecting a hallway.

An justified shooting that under any other circumstance would have cost the cop his job and probably his freedom, too. We both know that.

 

America is headed towards

a bloody bloody civil war.

FJB » 07 Jun 2023, 9:31 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:31 am

Democrats have the problem

you are allergic to the truth.

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 9:31 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:31 am

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/loca ... l/2535527/

Let's review the footage, together. Police had that door secure from the outside but for some reason, abandoned their post. It is clear from the video the hallway was empty...no Mike Pence or anyone else to be seen. No chants of "hang Pence" can be heard on the video. So we know for a fact the officer wasn't protecting life but rather protecting a hallway.

An justified shooting that under any other circumstance would have cost the cop his job and probably his freedom, too. We both know that.

The hallway on ONE side of the door was empty.  The hallway on the OTHER side of the door was filled with an angry mob going about the business of smashing the window in that locked door.  The fact that one cannot hear the specific words "Hang Mike Pence" on that short little film clip does not change the fact that footage does exist of the crowd repeatedly shouting just that.  Officer Byrd was standing in a doorway off of the empty corridor.  WITH HIS GUN DRAWN. WHICH THE CROWD SAW.  Behind the door he was standing in front of were members of Congress and, reportedly, Mike Pence had been in that room as well although we know he was spirited out of it at some point.  Officer Byrd knew that some number of people he was charged with protecting were behind the door and he knew that an angry mob was smashing through the windows on the locked door that separated them.  Do I know why the LEO's left the door?  I would suspect cowardice was at play, but I don't know for sure. I DO know that, as frightened as HE might have been, Officer Byrd stood his post, and protected the people he knew were behind the door.  And when the first person climbed THROUGH that broken window, Officer Byrd did his duty.  And by doing so, he stopped the mob from coming through that window and he saved the lives of the public officials behind the door.

And do me a **** favor:  Don't you EVER tell ME what WE BOTH KNOW.  Got it?  Here's what I know:  I know that I congratulate Officer Byrd for his bravery and patriotism on a frightening day.  And I know that if I were to somehow find myself in the vicinity, I'd probably take a piss on Ashli Babbitt's grave.  THAT'S what I know.  What YOU claim to know is your own **** business.

maineman » 07 Jun 2023, 9:52 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:52 am

The hallway on ONE side of the door was empty.  The hallway on the OTHER side of the door was filled with an angry mob going about the business of smashing the window in that locked door.  The fact that one cannot hear the specific words "Hang Mike Pence" on that short little film clip does not change the fact that footage does exist of the crowd repeatedly shouting just that.  Officer Byrd was standing in a doorway off of the empty corridor.  WITH HIS GUN DRAWN. WHICH THE CROWD SAW.  Behind the door he was standing in front of were members of Congress and, reportedly, Mike Pence had been in that room as well although we know he was spirited out of it at some point.  Officer Byrd knew that some number of people he was charged with protecting were behind the door and he knew that an angry mob was smashing through the windows on the locked door that separated them.  Do I know why the LEO's left the door?  I would suspect cowardice was at play, but I don't know for sure. I DO know that, as frightened as HE might have been, Officer Byrd stood his post, and protected the people he knew were behind the door.  And when the first person climbed THROUGH that broken window, Officer Byrd did his duty.  And by doing so, he stopped the mob from coming through that window and he saved the lives of the public officials behind the door.

And do me a **** favor:  Don't you EVER tell ME what WE BOTH KNOW.  Got it?  Here's what I know:  I know that I congratulate Officer Byrd for his bravery and patriotism on a frightening day.  And I know that if I were to somehow find myself in the vicinity, I'd probably take a piss on Ashli Babbitt's grave.  THAT'S what I know.  What YOU claim to know is your own **** business.

Things we both know from video evidence:
1. The cops had that door secure and none felt threatened enough to even have a weapon drawn.
2. The video doesn't show the crowd had weapons.
3. The hallway behind the door was empty.
4. Cops with weapons appeared immediately after the officer bravely shot Babbit.

If Officer Byrd did his duty shooting down the trespasser, then every other officer who didn't fire on the crowd was derelict in their duty, I suppose....and Adam Kinzinger wept.
 

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 9:31 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 9:31 am

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/loca ... l/2535527/

Let's review the footage, together. Police had that door secure from the outside but for some reason, abandoned their post. It is clear from the video the hallway was empty...no Mike Pence or anyone else to be seen. No chants of "hang Pence" can be heard on the video. So we know for a fact the officer wasn't protecting life but rather protecting a hallway.

An justified shooting that under any other circumstance would have cost the cop his job and probably his freedom, too. We both know that.

what is a hallway?

 

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am

Things we both know from video evidence:
1. The cops had that door secure and none felt threatened enough to even have a weapon drawn.
2. The video doesn't show the crowd had weapons.
3. The hallway behind the door was empty.
4. Cops with weapons appeared immediately after the officer bravely shot Babbit.

If Officer Byrd did his duty shooting down the trespasser, then every other officer who didn't fire on the crowd was derelict in their duty, I suppose....and Adam Kinzinger wept.

how do you know they did not feel threatened?

with all those yelling lunatics smashing glass, any sane person would feel threatened.

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am

Things we both know from video evidence:
1. The cops had that door secure and none felt threatened enough to even have a weapon drawn.
2. The video doesn't show the crowd had weapons.
3. The hallway behind the door was empty.
4. Cops with weapons appeared immediately after the officer bravely shot Babbit.

If Officer Byrd did his duty shooting down the trespasser, then every other officer who didn't fire on the crowd was derelict in their duty, I suppose....and Adam Kinzinger wept.

look up the word weapon.

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am

Things we both know from video evidence:
1. The cops had that door secure and none felt threatened enough to even have a weapon drawn.
2. The video doesn't show the crowd had weapons.
3. The hallway behind the door was empty.
4. Cops with weapons appeared immediately after the officer bravely shot Babbit.

If Officer Byrd did his duty shooting down the trespasser, then every other officer who didn't fire on the crowd was derelict in their duty, I suppose....and Adam Kinzinger wept.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What is the full meaning of weapon?
weap·​on. ˈwep-ən. : something (as a gun, knife, or club) used to injure, defeat, or destroy. : something with which one fights or struggles against another.Apr 2

jerrab » 07 Jun 2023, 10:07 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:07 am

what is a hallway?

 An area in a building onto which rooms open; a corridor.

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:05 am

Things we both know from video evidence:
1. The cops had that door secure and none felt threatened enough to even have a weapon drawn.
2. The video doesn't show the crowd had weapons.
3. The hallway behind the door was empty.
4. Cops with weapons appeared immediately after the officer bravely shot Babbit.

If Officer Byrd did his duty shooting down the trespasser, then every other officer who didn't fire on the crowd was derelict in their duty, I suppose....and Adam Kinzinger wept.

1. "secure" is a relative term.  How secure would I feel standing with my back to a door and a mob of hundreds of people were pushing up against me and trying to smash the windows of that door?  
2.  The video doesn't show the crowd with FIREARMS, they were certainly using a variety of blunt objects to cudgel their way through the door.
3.  the hallway was empty, but the rooms with doors leading into that hallway were not.  The one doorway leading into the hallway that Officer Byrd stood in front ot with his gun drawn, warning people to stay back away from supposedly held members of Congress, the people HE was tasked with protecting.
4.  If they had gotten on the scene a little bit earlier, maybe one of them would be had the honor or sending Ashli to Hell.
5.  I would agree with you.  I think the body count of January 6th insurrectionists ought to have been at least triple digits

jerrab » 07 Jun 2023, 10:15 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:15 am

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What is the full meaning of weapon?
weap·​on. ˈwep-ən. : something (as a gun, knife, or club) used to injure, defeat, or destroy. : something with which one fights or struggles against another.Apr 2

A phone can be a weapon, I suppose. I'd not want to get hit by one thrown at me.

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 10:16 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:16 am

A phone can be a weapon, I suppose. I'd not want to get hit by one thrown at me.

that big black round thing that guy used to smash the window in the video..... how do you think it would feel if he used it to repeatedly smash your forehead instead?

Would you consider it to be an attack with a deadly weapon?

neueregel » 07 Jun 2023, 10:16 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:16 am

A phone can be a weapon, I suppose. I'd not want to get hit by one thrown at me.

and they had weapons, clubs (flag poles?) breaking the windows with. it was mayhem there.

maineman » 07 Jun 2023, 10:16 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:16 am

1. "secure" is a relative term.  How secure would I feel standing with my back to a door and a mob of hundreds of people were pushing up against me and trying to smash the windows of that door?  
2.  The video doesn't show the crowd with FIREARMS, they were certainly using a variety of blunt objects to cudgel their way through the door.
3.  the hallway was empty, but the rooms with doors leading into that hallway were not.  The one doorway leading into the hallway that Officer Byrd stood in front ot with his gun drawn, warning people to stay back away from supposedly held members of Congress, the people HE was tasked with protecting.
4.  If they had gotten on the scene a little bit earlier, maybe one of them would be had the honor or sending Ashli to Hell.
5.  I would agree with you.  I think the body count of January 6th insurrectionists ought to have been at least triple digits

1. The cops felt secure enough to not even brandish a weapon...before they left their post.
2. I saw one man use a helmet to hit the glass. That could be a weapon, I suppose.
3. No idea where those doors led or who was behind them. We can see from the footage that there was time to barricade those doors with chairs. Seems pretty reasonable there was also ample time to leave those offices and move to a more secure location.
4. How do we know they weren't already on the scene?....not shooting people.
5.  

maineman » 07 Jun 2023, 10:19 am » wrote: ↑

07 Jun 2023, 10:19 am

that big black round thing that guy used to smash the window in the video..... how do you think it would feel if he used it to repeatedly smash your forehead instead?

Would you consider it to be an attack with a deadly weapon?

I wouldn't want to be hit with a helmet.