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9/11 was an inside job. Change my mind.
9/11 was an inside job. Change my mind.
By Vegas
22 Jul 2023 12:05 pm in No Holds Barred Political Forum
3 Aug 2023 4:07 pm
Look at Light Post 5 again....Vegas » 03 Aug 2023, 3:25 pm » wrote: ↑ Some of the pics are difficult to make out. However, this one may be better. Go to 1:36 on your animation - Lamp post 5. Two things:
1. The lamp post in the lawn area, where your animation shows, is still there. Am I wrong? If I am, then what am I seeing?
2. The other posts were right in the path of the plane, but are standing. I admit that it's hard to see , due to this distance, but it seems to be the same poles that your animation is showing.
In the animation photo, it is shown downed and its location is obstructed in this picture you posted.... The location of Post #5 in relation to this picture would be on the left side of the pic ---you see a smaller 2 story structure with a yellow Emergency vehicle parked in front of it.. Now following a line from the building and yellow Truck , you can see a Pentagon Complex Roadway with a Bus parked on it to the right of the cluster of trees... This is before reaching the Highway in the photo... The Light Post would be on the lawn in front of the Bus or other vehicles on the Complex Roadway or further left in front of the cluster of trees next to the highway... Either location, it would be obstructed from view....
If you see where the Highway is adjacent to that same cluster of trees on the far left of photo, you will notice there is a slight decline in the terrain (the Highway sits higher than the Pentagon building & grounds) .... The Photo of downed Post 4 is shown clearly on this embankment and adjacent to the Highway....
3 Aug 2023 4:10 pm
You weren't suppose to peek while they were busy planting those pieces of an American Airlines Boeing 757.
3 Aug 2023 4:19 pm
True,Z09 » 02 Aug 2023, 12:05 pm » wrote: ↑ Why would they air something at one point ...
...And not air it again?
Simple..
Because throughout the days there's updates and more information coming out..
Simply because you see something on TV at 11 AM but 3 PM there's much more news..
Unless of course if you have one reporter covering 20 different stories at the same time
I remember 9/11 vividly, and initially there were people insisting the Twin Towers were also attacked with Missiles, despite the many eyewitnesses who saw & reported seeing commercial Airlines striking the World Trade Center.....
And when the first images / videos of the Planes were made available showing the Planes hitting the towers, many of the inside Jobbers still refused to believe it --- insisting the footage had been manipulated to appear as American Airline 757s , when in fact it was a Missile strike
3 Aug 2023 4:31 pm
Or body parts belonging to the passengers and crew of Flight 77 ---if they even existed of course.Z09 » 03 Aug 2023, 4:12 pm » wrote: ↑ Amazing how there's no footage of plane parts being BROUGHT to the Pentagon
3 Aug 2023 4:48 pm
Are you sure it's the wrong angle? The animation has the plane going over the circular pathway. It went in on an angle. This pic appears to be the same angle. Yes, there is a lot of obstruction in the pic. I agree. I couldn't find one better. I was trying to find one that showed the same angle as the plane would have entered. Also, I have heard of many cases where emergency crews needed to cut down obstructions to allow their vehicles better access to the scenes. I didn't hear that to happen at the pentagon. I am just saying that it's not uncommon for that to happen.Kobia2 » 03 Aug 2023, 4:07 pm » wrote: ↑ Look at Light Post 5 again....
In the animation photo, it is shown downed and its location is obstructed in this picture you posted.... The location of Post #5 in relation to this picture would be on the left side of the pic ---you see a smaller 2 story structure with a yellow Emergency vehicle parked in front of it.. Now following a line from the building and yellow Truck , you can see a Pentagon Complex Roadway with a Bus parked on it to the right of the cluster of trees... This is before reaching the Highway in the photo... The Light Post would be on the lawn in front of the Bus or other vehicles on the Complex Roadway or further left in front of the cluster of trees next to the highway... Either location, it would be obstructed from view....
If you see where the Highway is adjacent to that same cluster of trees on the far left of photo, you will notice there is a slight decline in the terrain (the Highway sits higher than the Pentagon building & grounds) .... The Photo of downed Post 4 is shown clearly on this embankment and adjacent to the Highway....
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
3 Aug 2023 4:49 pm
Z09 » 03 Aug 2023, 4:12 pm » wrote: ↑ Amazing how there's no footage of plane parts being BROUGHT to the Pentagon
What? Why would there be if they were covering up?
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
3 Aug 2023 5:15 pm
Z09 » 03 Aug 2023, 5:10 pm » wrote: ↑ Can you maybe show us all these people that said they saw a missile?
Can you show me where the plane is? The one in the pentagon.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
3 Aug 2023 7:45 pm
This is an overhead depiction of the final path the Plane was on when it struck the Pentagon.....Vegas » 03 Aug 2023, 4:48 pm » wrote: ↑ Are you sure it's the wrong angle? The animation has the plane going over the circular pathway. It went in on an angle. This pic appears to be the same angle. Yes, there is a lot of obstruction in the pic. I agree. I couldn't find one better. I was trying to find one that showed the same angle as the plane would have entered. Also, I have heard of many cases where emergency crews needed to cut down obstructions to allow their vehicles better access to the scenes. I didn't hear that to happen at the pentagon. I am just saying that it's not uncommon for that to happen.
I'd mentioned before the angle in which some of the pictures on the ground were taken unquestionably caused confusion ... In some, it made it appear as though there was a tight grouping of numerous Street Lights, in a circle pattern that would have resulted in many more of them having to be struck in order for the Plane to have flown that route..... I'd also mentioned the aerial photos showed a more accurate positioning of this cluster of Lights, as they were much closer to the parking lot rather than the point of impact -- which is in fact the case.....
When you look at this schematic, the 5 Light Posts which the Plane struck and downed are in Yellow... The cluster / circle of Lights and some others marked in Blue are along the roundabout which you can see is closer to the parking lot....
Also,
There is the single Orange Dot in the upper right portion of this schematic depicting what is termed an Exit Hole.. This is an Outer Wall of C-Ring which was the furthest point (310 feet ) pieces of the PLane reached.
3 Aug 2023 8:02 pm
Had there even been the slightest plausible rumour, let alone proof that a Missile struck the Pentagon -- or that elements of our government ESPECIALLY the George W Bush Administration murdered 3000 of our own people on 9/11, every single Mainstream Media organization in the galaxy would never have cut their losses, abandoned their wishful conspiracy thinking, and dropped the story... Look how they handled Rusia-Gate, and the lengths they went to destroy Trump, knowing there was nothing to the story...Z09 » 03 Aug 2023, 5:19 pm » wrote: ↑ There's photos of plane parts but you don't believe them...
There's members of Congress that viewed the site and saw debris.....But you don't believe them..
I really wish you'd produce the people that saw a missile so I can call them liars..
But you don't have anyone that saw a missile...
3 Aug 2023 11:59 pm
1. I freely admit that I cannot say with certainty that the post I see in my pic is the same as the one in this schematic and in your animation. The yellow dot to the left of the middle plane, in the schematic, is the one that, to me anyway, is the same one in my pic, which is still standing. Yet, it was supposed to be clipped. Again, with the congestion and obstructions, I admit that I cannot say it is the same one with certainty.Kobia2 » 03 Aug 2023, 7:45 pm » wrote: ↑ This is an overhead depiction of the final path the Plane was on when it struck the Pentagon.....
I'd mentioned before the angle in which some of the pictures on the ground were taken unquestionably caused confusion ... In some, it made it appear as though there was a tight grouping of numerous Street Lights, in a circle pattern that would have resulted in many more of them having to be struck in order for the Plane to have flown that route..... I'd also mentioned the aerial photos showed a more accurate positioning of this cluster of Lights, as they were much closer to the parking lot rather than the point of impact -- which is in fact the case.....
When you look at this schematic, the 5 Light Posts which the Plane struck and downed are in Yellow... The cluster / circle of Lights and some others marked in Blue are along the roundabout which you can see is closer to the parking lot....
Also,
There is the single Orange Dot in the upper right portion of this schematic depicting what is termed an Exit Hole.. This is an Outer Wall of C-Ring which was the furthest point (310 feet ) pieces of the PLane reached.
2. I see the angle to which the plane hit. I still cannot see how the hole could only be 75 feet wide. That wing span is 125 feet. According to the sketch above, the hole doesn't account for that. I'll check the dimensions again. I was certain that the hole was 75 feet wide though. Maybe it was wider and I was misinformed.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
4 Aug 2023 12:20 am
The center fuselage of a 757 is 12 feet six inches.Vegas » 03 Aug 2023, 11:59 pm » wrote: ↑ 1. I freely admit that I cannot say with certainty that the post I see in my pic is the same as the one in this schematic and in your animation. The yellow dot to the left of the middle plane, in the schematic, is the one that, to me anyway, is the same one in my pic, which is still standing. Yet, it was supposed to be clipped. Again, with the congestion and obstructions, I admit that I cannot say it is the same one with certainty.
2. I see the angle to which the plane hit. I still cannot see how the hole could only be 75 feet wide. That wing span is 125 feet. According to the sketch above, the hole doesn't account for that. I'll check the dimensions again. I was certain that the hole was 75 feet wide though. Maybe it was wider and I was misinformed.
It weighed well over 200,000 pounds (100 tons) and was traveling 530 miles an hour (777 feet per second)
It was had the most destructive energy of any missile ever fired in world history. The energy was in billions or trillions of foot pounds.
As it passed through the aft section expanded, blowing out a 75 foot diameter hole.
4 Aug 2023 12:44 am
@Kobia2
This is from a site that attempts to debunk theories from people like me, LOL. It's their counter to claims, from myself and many others, that the pentagon was not hit by a plane.
1. Read the sentence that I put in bold. This has been my issue. One wing disintegrated, but the other sheared off due to its lightweight. It sheared off, it didn't disintegrate. According to their own claim, it couldn't penetrate the wall. Therefore, it couldn't be inside the hole. However, there is no indication of it being outside it either. Not in the lawn, not anywhere. Many commercial pilots have come forward with their doubts. They don't believe that it's possible for most of the plane to be inside the pentagon because of how reinforced the pentagon was. Especially the tail. The tail of a Boeing 757 has height of 44 feet. They are baffled as to how that could be in little piece inside the pentagon. The tail should be laying around outside somewhere.
2. The last paragraph is going off of a testimony. With all of the examples of scientists, researchers, and engineers selling out, I have a difficult time trusting their words.
This is from a site that attempts to debunk theories from people like me, LOL. It's their counter to claims, from myself and many others, that the pentagon was not hit by a plane.
1. Read the sentence that I put in bold. This has been my issue. One wing disintegrated, but the other sheared off due to its lightweight. It sheared off, it didn't disintegrate. According to their own claim, it couldn't penetrate the wall. Therefore, it couldn't be inside the hole. However, there is no indication of it being outside it either. Not in the lawn, not anywhere. Many commercial pilots have come forward with their doubts. They don't believe that it's possible for most of the plane to be inside the pentagon because of how reinforced the pentagon was. Especially the tail. The tail of a Boeing 757 has height of 44 feet. They are baffled as to how that could be in little piece inside the pentagon. The tail should be laying around outside somewhere.
2. The last paragraph is going off of a testimony. With all of the examples of scientists, researchers, and engineers selling out, I have a difficult time trusting their words.
THE PENTAGON ATTACK
How can a 125ft plane cause just a 16ft wide hole?
A Boeing 757 commercial airliner is 125ft wide and 155ft long. However, the plane that smashed into the Pentagon left an entry hole just 16ft across and an exit hole of just 12ft wide. How is this possible, ask sceptics? As far as many people are concerned, it is more likely that the Pentagon was hit by a satellite-guided missile controlled by the US military.
The official ASCE Pentagon Building Performance Report estimates that the hole punched into the outer E-Ring of the Pentagon’s reinforced concrete walls was actually about 75ft across, not 16ft, as has been widely misreported. That Flight 77 didn’t leave a 125ft, plane-shaped hole in the building is accounted for by the fact that one of the plane’s wings disintegrated when it hit the ground before impact and the other wing sheared off on impact, being of too lightweight a construction to penetrate reinforced concrete. The C-ring impact exit hole was, in fact, 12ft wide, not 16ft, and was most likely caused by the aircraft’s much sturdier landing gear punching its way through the building.Where’s the debris?Many point to the lack of debris in official photos taken after the plane hit the side of the Pentagon. When planes crash, they usually leave behind huge quantities of debris. How come a large commercial airliner hit a building yet left hardly any wreckage behind?MOST OF FLIGHT 77 ENDED UP INSIDE THE PENTAGON, NOT OUTSIDE IT.This claim is directly disputed by eyewitnesses who were first to respond. This includes Allyn E. Kilsheimer, CEO of KCE Structural Engineers PC in Washington. Kilsheimer was the man who found Flight 77’s black box recorder, as well as holding sections of the plane’s tail in his hands and observing a wing impact mark on the side of the building before a large section of the Pentagon’s outer wall collapsed. He also saw bits of body parts scattered around the crash site, as well as crew uniforms and passenger clothing. Also, most of Flight 77 ended up inside the Pentagon, not outside it.
https://www.history.co.uk/article/the-b ... s-debunked
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
4 Aug 2023 12:46 am
Bruce » 04 Aug 2023, 12:20 am » wrote: ↑ The center fuselage of a 757 is 12 feet six inches.
It weighed well over 200,000 pounds (100 tons) and was traveling 530 miles an hour (777 feet per second)
It was had the most destructive energy of any missile ever fired in world history. The energy was in billions or trillions of foot pounds.
As it passed through the aft section expanded, blowing out a 75 foot diameter hole.
Something that fierce, with a 125 foot wingspan, should have blown out a lot more than 75 feet.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
4 Aug 2023 2:21 am
You can't believe spokespeople, they don't know what they are talking about.. but you can believe the witnesses that say they saw a plane, forget about missing pictures, wreckage, too small holes, lampposts and other things that don't make sense.. they can't possibly all be lying, so there.. that invalidates your arguments.. zo9 'logic' at work...Vegas » 02 Aug 2023, 2:15 pm » wrote: ↑ Yes, you are reaching.
So now we can't even believe spokespeople, huh? How do you think you got all of your information from?
In memory of Pumpkins
4 Aug 2023 2:40 am
I have arguments and (missing) evidence to support my assertations & storyline, all you and zo9 have is.. but the witnesses said...Kobia2 » 03 Aug 2023, 1:58 pm » wrote: ↑ So it is your belief every single witness who saw A large commercial Airlines (many identifying specifically as an American Airlines) from a variety of distances and locations approaching / hitting the Pentagon ALL mistook a 16 ft long Missile with an 8.5 ft wingspan for a 155 ft long Boeing 757 with a 125 ft wingspan ( some seeing the AA Logo on the Tail) --- and many for the purpose of 15 minutes of fame?... Yet not a soul in the world witnessed anything remotely described as a Missile in the skies at the Pentagon that day, and without a shred of any type of evidence you are 1000% convinced that's what it was... The burdon & standard of proof you ask of everyone is not being applied to your own assertions & storyline...
But I don't mind, I had this 'discussion' before, it brings back fun memories.. so about that animation.. compare this part to the picture you posted.. yeah, it's those lampposts again...The last video I posted showed an animation of the Plane's path when it struck the Pentagon.... The animation included all 5 Light Posts that were indeed in the Plane's path that were knocked down by the wings of the 757 before impacting the Pentagon...Witnesses saw the Plane's wings hitting them... This was supported by actual photographic evidence of the 5 downed Light Posts, and their locations... The first photographs I posted depicting 2 of the downed Posts included the one which came down on the DC Cab driven by Lloyd England -- You asserted that both the car and the lamp post were planted and then damaged when none of the 1000s of people there were looking as part of the conspiracy....
In memory of Pumpkins
4 Aug 2023 6:16 am
As I just told the rear admiral..
In memory of Pumpkins
4 Aug 2023 6:20 am
That picture wasn't taken in the flight path the plane collided with the building. It is a good 20 degrees off to the left. Oops I wasn't supposed to notice. wonder what the magnification on the lens was to make it look closer than where they were.Vegas » 03 Aug 2023, 12:39 pm » wrote: ↑ Lampposts have a mind of their own. They probably just hopped out of the way or ducked. Lol
4 Aug 2023 6:59 am
Maybe you missed the title of the thread... we are not here to answer your questions, if you want to change people's mind that 9/11 wasn't an inside job you should answer some questions yourself...Z09 » 04 Aug 2023, 6:21 am » wrote: ↑
The questions are endless and you two just opens up with more and more people involved in your conspiracy.
Like, why aren't there any pictures of a plane hitting the Pentagon while there are plenty of them hitting the towers?
In memory of Pumpkins
4 Aug 2023 8:19 am
Vegas » 03 Aug 2023, 11:59 pm » wrote: ↑ 1. I freely admit that I cannot say with certainty that the post I see in my pic is the same as the one in this schematic and in your animation. The yellow dot to the left of the middle plane, in the schematic, is the one that, to me anyway, is the same one in my pic, which is still standing. Yet, it was supposed to be clipped. Again, with the congestion and obstructions, I admit that I cannot say it is the same one with certainty.
2. I see the angle to which the plane hit. I still cannot see how the hole could only be 75 feet wide. That wing span is 125 feet. According to the sketch above, the hole doesn't account for that. I'll check the dimensions again. I was certain that the hole was 75 feet wide though. Maybe it was wider and I was misinformed.
Your Pic was taken at ground level.... I think the aerial photos show a more accurate depiction of where these Light Posts actually stood, and were downed... As I mentioned, some of the photos taken at ground level made it appear there was a bunching of these Posts in front of the point of impact --- when we can clearly see from above they were at a roundabout closer to the parking lot.. Even if choosing to discount the Post you have in question, that still leaves the 4 remaining Posts... Again, the way these Posts are positioned and the distance (width) between them, it would have taken an aircraft with a wide enough wingspan to hit them.... Missiles do not have such wingspans...
The Fuselage of the Plane is much heavier than the wings and impacted the building nose- first -- punching the hole we see in the photos... In Robert Franken's (CNN) interview with Pilot Tim Timmerman we discussed, Timmerman describes the plane disintegrated on impact ---- this was most likely the wings... The momentum of the fuselage pulled this debris into the building... Debris from the 155 ft long 757 reached 310 feet, breaching E (the point of impact) Ring, D Ring and finally ending at C Ring.. I don't see it as a far reach the Tail following the rest of the plane into the building.... I just think many people were mistaken to believe the Plane would have punched a cookie cutter type hole in the shape of a Plane like we saw more inline with the first Tower that was struck at the World Trade Center... The difference was the wall construction of the buildings...
4 Aug 2023 8:45 am
lol... I actually answered your questions, you're the one that hasn't answered a single one of mine..Z09 » 04 Aug 2023, 8:31 am » wrote: ↑ "you're not here to answer questions..."
I cruise missile is sent from 1000 miles away on a morning that the entire country, air traffic controllers and NORAD is on high alert...
But you won't answer questions...?
It's because you can't...
Nah, I'm not going to bother with the copy/paste of my own quotes anymore, too much trouble and it won't do any good with team clueless anyway...
But you're welcome to prove me wrong, try to find a post of yourself where you actually answer a question..
In memory of Pumpkins
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