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9/11 was an inside job. Change my mind.
9/11 was an inside job. Change my mind.
By Vegas
22 Jul 2023 12:05 pm in No Holds Barred Political Forum
12 Aug 2023 1:50 pm
VegasVegas » 12 Aug 2023, 12:50 pm » wrote: ↑ The pentagon had 80 video cameras in the vicinity of the crash. All were confiscated except for that one blurry image from the security cam that doesn't show anything. You are saying that is normal and that we shouldn't be raising our eye brows?
I am dismissing their testimonies because it doesn't line up with physical evidence. The size of the hole, the fact that video from 80 different cameras are missing, there is no fire charcoal on the lawn just outside the crash, and that the damage looks like something from a missile, not a plane. Their testimonies are not lining up with physics nor physical evidence. They just aren't.
Because the burden of proof is on you. The ones that make the claim are the ones that have the burden of proof. The claim is that a plane hit the pentagon. Therefore, the burden of proof is on their shoulders. Period. That's how it works.
The pentagon had 80 video cameras in the vicinity of the crash. All were confiscated except for that one blurry image from the security cam that doesn't show anything. You are saying that is normal and that we shouldn't be raising our eye brows?
What were the security cameras mounted on buildings directed at?....... You are assuming there were high speed cameras pointed at the sky to capture an incoming attack.... They were most likely pointed at parking lots, pathways, roads, building entrances / exits, and other areas closer to ground level...
I am dismissing their testimonies because it doesn't line up with physical evidence. The size of the hole, the fact that video from 80 different cameras are missing, there is no fire charcoal on the lawn just outside the crash, and that the damage looks like something from a missile, not a plane. Their testimonies are not lining up with physics nor physical evidence. They just aren't.
You were shown plenty of physical evidence, which of course you insist was planted or fabricated... PLane debris from a Boeing 757, human remains from Flight 77 identified through DNA, the Flight Records of Flight 77, personal effects belonging to passengers & crew of Flight 77 identified by loved ones and returned to the victim's families At one point you conceded you were unaware and had not seen the 5 downed Street Light poles... You were shown photographs of the downed poles, along with a schematic of their positioning in relation to the Plane's path along with the distance between them which proved only an Aircraft with a wide enough wingspan like a 757 could have ,,, There isn't a Missile in existence today let alone in 2001 that had such a wingspan.. All of this is physical evidence which you deny or dismiss, but you accept & embrace alternative possibilities without any physical evidence at all...
Because the burden of proof is on you. The ones that make the claim are the ones that have the burden of proof. The claim is that a plane hit the pentagon. Therefore, the burden of proof is on their shoulders. Period. That's how it works.
Your confused.... You have made one claim after another which you could not prove which I clearly pointed out to you... Again, the Insider-Jobbers think they are the safe position where they can sling **** at the walls hoping something sticks, and when it doesn't (which it never does) they simply throw more.... That's how you think it ought to work.
12 Aug 2023 1:57 pm
You said in your post....Vegas » 12 Aug 2023, 1:12 pm » wrote: ↑ I never said they had their landing gear out. I said there would be some evidence of sheer markings on the lawn since the plane had to be that close to the ground upon entry. There isn't.
"However, notice in any pics, there are no tire marks or even burn marks from the flames within feet of the building. There would have to be some markings on the lawn that a plane landed there. Fire marks on the grass.
I pointed out there would have been no Tire marks because the landing gear would not have been deployed --- and the front of the building had collapsed outwards so any such marks or scorched grass would not have been seen under the tons of rubbles covering that gound.
12 Aug 2023 2:11 pm
Most of the witnesses who offered testimony seeing a large commercial airliner approaching, knocking down street lights or hitting the Pentagon WERE NOT employees or members of any government agency.... They were normal everyday people driving along the heavily congested roadway across from the building... How did you conclude every single one of these people were liars, coerced into silence, or complicit in the murder of 187 of their fellow citizens at the Pentagon that day?
12 Aug 2023 3:22 pm
MGM Grand Fire !!Bruce » 12 Aug 2023, 1:33 pm » wrote: ↑ MGM Grand Fire
—
The fire was limited to the first floor,[15] but the burning material created toxic fumes and smoke, which ascended throughout the hotel tower via vertical shafts (elevators and stairwells) and seismic joints, causing the majority of the deaths.[16] More than 200 firefighters responded to the fire,[17] and some reported having to crawl through the dark and over "mounds of stuff" trying to extinguish the fire. It was later determined that the "mounds" were deceased guests and staff near an elevator bank.[6] The Las Vegas fire department operated separately from the county fire department; the latter served the Las Vegas Strip, so city firefighters were unfamiliar with the MGM's layout, including fire escape routes. This hindered the rescue effort.[18]
——
Those steel and glass towers are over engineered.
The walls are glass, and the steel skeletons sway in the wind or else they’d come down. They all have automatic sprinkler systems, and emergency stair exits, all over the world, they share that.
What’s only happened one time in the history of steel and glass towers happened on 9/11.
Two planes, converted into the largest cruise missiles in world history, full of aviation fuel, over 200,000 pounds each, hit the two tallest towers on earth at 530 miles an hour, so high no ladder trucks can rescue anyone above the target point.
By the way, Deep State or Camel Jockeys, it was a perfect hit on both towers.
The sprinklers can’t put out a plane load of jet fuel. Not even close to put it out.
So Johnny here comes the cavalry, the best fire department on earth.
—-
343 FDNY firefighters died responding to the attacks on September 11, 2001. All of the 100,000 first responders and 400,000 other people who were working, living, and studying in Lower Manhattan on and after 9/11 have a higher incidence of 68 different types of cancer and many respiratory illnesses
——
So now two towers have came down and killed 343 firemen and converted every one of the others left alive to stay the **** out of burning steel and glass towers.
And when they came down that busted all the water mains and the sprinklers in WTC7 started drizzling.
They pumped a lot from pumper trucks, but the fires were just too hot to extinguish.
So they evacuated America’s Mayor Rudy and let it come down
I was there !!
Real life !!
Some people were jumping out windows!! Firemen could not get up that high
with ladders.
That was the fire that forced all hi-rises to install water sprinklers to all floors.
I was a young Whipper-Snapper back then. Trying hard to be a professional
poker player. The whores and the cougars would not leave me alone.
HHhhhhheeeeeehhhhhhhh......LOL....
Damn....."the good old days" !!
https://youtu.be/129kuDCQtHs
12 Aug 2023 7:30 pm
It's one thing to get a group of people ---- all affiliated in some way --- at a single place -- coerced or working in unison to testify to an event they saw unfold, to support the same narrative.... But this is simply not the case ...Z09 » 12 Aug 2023, 2:47 pm » wrote: ↑ Well said...
Hundreds of witnesses that offered testimony it was an airplane..
And not a single one that said it was a cruise missile.
But...
It's "our burden to show proof"...
So many of these eyewitnesses were strangers to one another --- and watched what they described as the Plane from different vantage points & locations... Many were in the slow moving traffic on Interstate 395 ---- others saw what transpired from the Sheraton Hotel or apartment windows -- the Pentagon grounds themselves -- offices & businesses in the immediate area --- from an airborne C-130 Cargo plane etc -- an Air Traffic Control Tower --- cars driving on Route 27 Washington Blvd. ----- etc...
Not plausible and makes zero sense..
12 Aug 2023 7:54 pm
Bin Laden's body should have been handled & disposed of with all the respect & dignity he deserved... It should have been wrapped in Bacon -- cremated -- then had his ashes blown into an open sewer ditch by a farting Camel.Bruce » 12 Aug 2023, 12:45 pm » wrote: ↑ Yep, that was the entire point.
There are about a billion rag heads over there that keep their women wrapped up in black shrouds so no other man will want them.
They murder their sisters and daughters for having a cigarette or a beer, or being alone with a boy.
They don’t think their dead should be violated and must be buried within 24 hours.
Only a few Americans believe Osama is alive today.
The rag heads believe Obama killed him.
12 Aug 2023 7:56 pm
sootedupCyndi » 12 Aug 2023, 12:23 pm » wrote: ↑ Well? if someone buried you out to sea- I'd be thinkin- That was fishy. Swimming with the fish-ees.
He probably bobbed around for a few days --- th curious sharks probably mistaking him for a piece of whale ****...
12 Aug 2023 9:19 pm
One of two reasons:Kobia2 » 12 Aug 2023, 2:11 pm » wrote: ↑ Most of the witnesses who offered testimony seeing a large commercial airliner approaching, knocking down street lights or hitting the Pentagon WERE NOT employees or members of any government agency.... They were normal everyday people driving along the heavily congested roadway across from the building... How did you conclude every single one of these people were liars, coerced into silence, or complicit in the murder of 187 of their fellow citizens at the Pentagon that day?
1. I still maintain that perhaps it could have been a drone carrying explosives. They are white with wings, and could easily be mistaken as a plane. Especially to anyone who is trying to drive and can't look for longer than a second. Also, drones are not as sturdy as a Boeing 757. They could easily crumple and dintegrate upon impact into nothing. A plane? Not a chance. There would be some debris around the lawn, easily.
2. Crisis actors.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
12 Aug 2023 9:23 pm
Kobia2 » 12 Aug 2023, 1:57 pm » wrote: ↑ You said in your post....
"However, notice in any pics, there are no tire marks or even burn marks from the flames within feet of the building. There would have to be some markings on the lawn that a plane landed there. Fire marks on the grass.
I pointed out there would have been no Tire marks because the landing gear would not have been deployed --- and the front of the building had collapsed outwards so any such marks or scorched grass would not have been seen under the tons of rubbles covering that gound.
When I said a plane landed there, I didn't mean it had it's wheels out, as you can see from my post. I meant it would have some markings from the plane hit the bottom in the grass first. The 9/11 commission report stated that the plane hit the ground right before it entered the building. Yet, there is no evidence of that.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
12 Aug 2023 9:29 pm
There is this great divide, in America today.Kobia2 » 12 Aug 2023, 7:54 pm » wrote: ↑ Bin Laden's body should have been handled & disposed of with all the respect & dignity he deserved... It should have been wrapped in Bacon -- cremated -- then had his ashes blown into an open sewer ditch by a farting Camel.
Are you of the tribe of the Lord, or of the heathen?
Here’s to you, my dear angel mother, who made me memorize this poem, one of the greatest poems of the English language. She had this quilted pink robe, and not one trace of age on her face, when I learned this sixty years ago:
Abou Ben Adhem (may his tribe increase!)
Awoke one night from a deep dream of peace
,And saw, within the moonlight in his room,
Making it rich, and like a lily in bloom,
An angel writing in a book of gold:
Exceeding peace had made Ben Adhem bold,
And to the presence in the room he said,
,"What writest thou?"
The vision raised its head,
And with a look made of all sweet accord,Answered,
"The names of those who love the Lord."
"And is mine one?" said Abou.
"Nay, not so,"Replied the angel.
Abou spoke more low,But cheerly still; and said,
I pray thee, then,Write me as one that loves his fellow men."
The angel wrote, and vanished.
The next night came again with a great wakening light,
And showed the names whom love of God had blest,
And lo! Ben Adhem's name led all the rest.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abou_Ben_Adhem_(poem)
—-
Every word, of every line, she made me memorize when I was five years old, and could not read any of the words.
My father said essentially the same thing when he’d often say, the best Christians he’d ever known, had never darkened a church house door.
Christ loves those, who love his sheep.
12 Aug 2023 9:36 pm
80 cameras and not one of them showed anything? Come on. Then what would be the point of confiscating them if their content was of no value?Kobia2 » 12 Aug 2023, 1:50 pm » wrote: ↑
What were the security cameras mounted on buildings directed at?....... You are assuming there were high speed cameras pointed at the sky to capture an incoming attack.... They were most likely pointed at parking lots, pathways, roads, building entrances / exits, and other areas closer to ground level...
I dismiss it because it is 'claimed' to be the case. Proving me wrong should be easy. All you have to do is show me the plane wreck at the pentagon. You showed me pics of a wreckage. There is no evidence that was from the pentagon. It could be from anywhere. There was only one pic you showed me that had a piece in the lawn. Two problems: 1. If you look at the background, the crews already put out most of the fire, it was just smoke. That means That pic could have been taken up to a couple hours after the crash. 2. Look at that piece. It looks like it was washed and even waxed. Hell, my car doesn't look that clean after I wash and wax it.You were shown plenty of physical evidence, which of course you insist was planted or fabricated... PLane debris from a Boeing 757, human remains from Flight 77 identified through DNA, the Flight Records of Flight 77, personal effects belonging to passengers & crew of Flight 77 identified by loved ones and returned to the victim's families At one point you conceded you were unaware and had not seen the 5 downed Street Light poles... You were shown photographs of the downed poles, along with a schematic of their positioning in relation to the Plane's path along with the distance between them which proved only an Aircraft with a wide enough wingspan like a 757 could have ,,, There isn't a Missile in existence today let alone in 2001 that had such a wingspan.. All of this is physical evidence which you deny or dismiss, but you accept & embrace alternative possibilities without any physical evidence at all...
This is what would convince me:
1. Pics of wreckage outside the pentagon such as pieces of the tail or wings.
2. Burn marks on the ground where the official 9/11 report claimed the plane hit before it hit the wall.
3. A credible reason as to why all 80 cameras were confiscated.
The claim is that a plane hit the pentagon. Billions of people are claiming that. What I claim could have happened is irrelevant. The burden of proof is on the original claim. Not me.Your confused.... You have made one claim after another which you could not prove which I clearly pointed out to you... Again, the Insider-Jobbers think they are the safe position where they can sling **** at the walls hoping something sticks, and when it doesn't (which it never does) they simply throw more.... That's how you think it ought to work.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
12 Aug 2023 9:38 pm
Bruce » 12 Aug 2023, 1:33 pm » wrote: ↑ MGM Grand Fire
—
The fire was limited to the first floor,[15] but the burning material created toxic fumes and smoke, which ascended throughout the hotel tower via vertical shafts (elevators and stairwells) and seismic joints, causing the majority of the deaths.[16] More than 200 firefighters responded to the fire,[17] and some reported having to crawl through the dark and over "mounds of stuff" trying to extinguish the fire. It was later determined that the "mounds" were deceased guests and staff near an elevator bank.[6] The Las Vegas fire department operated separately from the county fire department; the latter served the Las Vegas Strip, so city firefighters were unfamiliar with the MGM's layout, including fire escape routes. This hindered the rescue effort.[18]
——
Those steel and glass towers are over engineered.
The walls are glass, and the steel skeletons sway in the wind or else they’d come down. They all have automatic sprinkler systems, and emergency stair exits, all over the world, they share that.
What’s only happened one time in the history of steel and glass towers happened on 9/11.
Two planes, converted into the largest cruise missiles in world history, full of aviation fuel, over 200,000 pounds each, hit the two tallest towers on earth at 530 miles an hour, so high no ladder trucks can rescue anyone above the target point.
By the way, Deep State or Camel Jockeys, it was a perfect hit on both towers.
The sprinklers can’t put out a plane load of jet fuel. Not even close to put it out.
So Johnny here comes the cavalry, the best fire department on earth.
—-
343 FDNY firefighters died responding to the attacks on September 11, 2001. All of the 100,000 first responders and 400,000 other people who were working, living, and studying in Lower Manhattan on and after 9/11 have a higher incidence of 68 different types of cancer and many respiratory illnesses
——
So now two towers have came down and killed 343 firemen and converted every one of the others left alive to stay the **** out of burning steel and glass towers.
And when they came down that busted all the water mains and the sprinklers in WTC7 started drizzling.
They pumped a lot from pumper trucks, but the fires were just too hot to extinguish.
So they evacuated America’s Mayor Rudy and let it come down
The sprinklers at the MGM were outdated and they didn't work. The point I am making is that you can't find one building fire that caused a building to just fall down. They burn down.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
12 Aug 2023 10:09 pm
Vegas » 12 Aug 2023, 9:36 pm » wrote: ↑ 80 cameras and not one of them showed anything? Come on. Then what would be the point of confiscating them if their content was of no value?
I dismiss it because it is 'claimed' to be the case. Proving me wrong should be easy. All you have to do is show me the plane wreck at the pentagon. You showed me pics of a wreckage. There is no evidence that was from the pentagon. It could be from anywhere. There was only one pic you showed me that had a piece in the lawn. Two problems: 1. If you look at the background, the crews already put out most of the fire, it was just smoke. That means That pic could have been taken up to a couple hours after the crash. 2. Look at that piece. It looks like it was washed and even waxed. Hell, my car doesn't look that clean after I wash and wax it.
This is what would convince me:
1. Pics of wreckage outside the pentagon such as pieces of the tail or wings.
2. Burn marks on the ground where the official 9/11 report claimed the plane hit before it hit the wall.
3. A credible reason as to why all 80 cameras were confiscated.
The claim is that a plane hit the pentagon. Billions of people are claiming that. What I claim could have happened is irrelevant. The burden of proof is on the original claim. Not me.
Are you really this **** stupid or are you just trolling Kobia and Z09? I'm guessing the latter.
12 Aug 2023 10:11 pm
Rock » 12 Aug 2023, 10:09 pm » wrote: ↑ Are you really this **** stupid or are you just trolling Kobia and Z09? I'm guessing the latter.
Translation: You got nothing, so you decided to project your ignorance onto me.
Okay got it.
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
12 Aug 2023 10:29 pm
Vegas » 12 Aug 2023, 10:11 pm » wrote: ↑ Translation: You got nothing, so you decided to project your ignorance onto me.
Okay got it.
I guess that answers my question. You're not trolling the other members of the forum.
12 Aug 2023 10:50 pm
Rock » 12 Aug 2023, 10:29 pm » wrote: ↑ I guess that answers my question. You're not trolling the other members of the forum.
Well, you could try answering my questions. Z09 keeps running from them. My questions are fair, they aren't obscure or ridiculous.
1. Out of 80 cameras, how come there is no footage of the plane hitting the pentagon? That one video of a white blurry thing is ridiculous.
2. The official 9/11 report stated that the plane hit the ground right before it hit the wall. Where are the marks on the grass? There aren't even any burn marks.
3. And finally, wait for it....wait for it...drum roll...where is the plane?
Blackvegatble's hypcorisy summed up in one post:
[/size]
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
Blackvegetable » 7 minutes ago » wrote: ↑7 minutes ago
Very simple questions...
From which you are running...
12 Aug 2023 11:02 pm
They did work. The fire was put out on on the first floor. The MGM fire was out a long time before the heat compromised the steel support beams.Vegas » 12 Aug 2023, 9:38 pm » wrote: ↑ The sprinklers at the MGM were outdated and they didn't work. The point I am making is that you can't find one building fire that caused a building to just fall down. They burn down.
And every other fire in a modern steel and glass tower all over the world has always turned out the same, the sprinklers and the fire trucks win and extinguish the fire quickly.
But even if the Deep State took down WTC7 they waited eight hours. During that eight hours the NYFD fought a losing battle with pumper trucks to fight a fire where the remains of WTC 1 and 2 made it so hot they couldn’t fight the fire from that side.
12 Aug 2023 11:03 pm
All of these questions were addressed by Kobia. You just chose to ignore them.Vegas » 12 Aug 2023, 10:50 pm » wrote: ↑ Well, you could try answering my questions. Z09 keeps running from them. My questions are fair, they aren't obscure or ridiculous.
1. Out of 80 cameras, how come there is no footage of the plane hitting the pentagon? That one video of a white blurry thing is ridiculous.
2. The official 9/11 report stated that the plane hit the ground right before it hit the wall. Where are the marks on the grass? There aren't even any burn marks.
3. And finally, wait for it....wait for it...drum roll...where is the plane?
12 Aug 2023 11:08 pm
12 Aug 2023 11:33 pm
Vegas
80 cameras and not one of them showed anything? Come on. Then what would be the point of confiscating them if their content was of no value?
Why would you not expect any camera or video footage of the attack on the Pentagon to be confiscated for investigation into what happened, and use as evidence in the 9/11 trials?.... As of 2022, there are still 5 detainees at Gitmo charged with plotting & orchestrating the 9/11 attacks... You insist that because you haven't been shown all the photos or anything else being held as evidence in this case, that it simply does not exist... At present after all these years, it looks as though plea agreements may be reached for some of them to avoid death penalty sentences.. Once the cases are all settled I agree all evidence should be made public..
I dismiss it because it is 'claimed' to be the case. Proving me wrong should be easy. All you have to do is show me the plane wreck at the pentagon. You showed me pics of a wreckage. There is no evidence that was from the pentagon. It could be from anywhere. There was only one pic you showed me that had a piece in the lawn. Two problems: 1. If you look at the background, the crews already put out most of the fire, it was just smoke. That means That pic could have been taken up to a couple hours after the crash. 2. Look at that piece. It looks like it was washed and even waxed. Hell, my car doesn't look that clean after I wash and wax it.
You were very easily & repeatedly proven wrong and will continue to be so...... You were shown numerous pieces of Aircraft debris from both inside and outside the Pentagon... You were shown photos of the Heliport Tarmac which was covered with small pieces of building and Aircraft debris.... The mostly hollow wings which were much lighter than the Planes fuselage shattered into small pieces when striking the building, and the tail remained attached and also entered through the Pentagon wall... This was immediately followed by a huge explosion -- witnesses saw this.. You were shown a photo of a Compressor Disk Hub from a Rolls Royce RB211-535E4B engine, recovered at the scene.. You were provided a photo of a Combustion casing for the engine's fuel injectors --- again from a Rolls Royce RB211-535E4B... You were shown a photo of the engine's Turbine compressor shaft... You were shown photos of the Plane's damaged Flight Recorders -- You have been shown photos of pieces of shredded aluminum with yellow Primer on them which is used on Aircrafts... You were shown a photo of one of the PLane's Wheel Hubs from a Boeing 757's landing gear....
On the heliport thousands of tiny shards of airplane wreckage cover the ground, 9/11/01 — Photo by jamie McIntyre ©2001
https://aerospaceweb.org/question/consp ... 0265.shtml
https://aerospaceweb.org/question/consp ... 0290.shtml
757 Wheel Hub in Pentagon debris.
This is what would convince me:
2. Burn marks on the ground where the official 9/11 report claimed the plane hit before it hit the wall.
This is the 9/11 Report in its entirety.... Show me where it says such in the Report... https://www.9-11commission.gov/report/911Report.pdf
3. A credible reason as to why all 80 cameras were confiscated.
Read above... This was explained.
The claim is that a plane hit the pentagon. Billions of people are claiming that. What I claim could have happened is irrelevant. The burden of proof is on the original claim. Not me.
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