Liberal Forum

Warcok » 11 Sep 2023, 1:50 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 1:50 pm

Dayyyyum
 

GHETTOBLASTER » 11 Sep 2023, 2:38 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 2:38 pm

The limits are IMPRACTICABLE..but only an honest person like me would include that very important distinction....not you.

A limit is a limit. This is not news. These limits have existed for years. If I was to buy an EV (which is on the radar next time we buy a vehicle).. I would be fully aware of these limits and take them into consideration. 

https://www.gm.com/commitments/electrification

https://www.ford.com/electric/

https://www.chrysler.com/chrysler-innov ... rflow.html

———

https://www.tesla.com/Model3

From  $29,740*
After Federal Tax Credit & Est. Gas Savings
 

 

impartialobserver » 11 Sep 2023, 2:32 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 2:32 pm

Gee.. A technology that has limits. No one could have seen this coming

And here we have the difference between a sniper and a snipper.  

RedheadedStranger » 11 Sep 2023, 10:11 am » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 10:11 am

Without a doubt.

What's funny is, in my personal situation at the moment, an EV would be perfect for me.

With the exception of the occasional road trip, I'm probably only driving a couple a hundred miles a week right now, if that. A tank of gasoline typically last me around two weeks, or more sometimes... and my truck only gets about 15-17 mpg.

I could charge up at home on Sunday, and be good until the next Sunday about 99% of the time. 

If the EV prices crash through the floor as predicted, I'm going to seriously consider one as a third vehicle for the wife and I. We have an '07 Eclipse that only has 70k miles on it right now that is our third car, but we're about to donate it to a battered single mother that needs a car so... we'll be looking to replace it soon.

I'd pay $15-20K or so for a N.O.S. F-150 Lightning and rig a charger up at the house for it for sure.

More and more people will consider an EV as time goes on. Americans love their vehicles and waste 10's of thousands of dollars in their lifetime to acquire a status symbol (illusion)that fits them. I'm a cheap bastard and always had a hard time buying a depreciating asset. We tend to drive the wheels off our cars. Pretty sure I'm driving the ugliest car right now. Mom's 1998 Subaru Forester, 85k miles, interior mint, body mint, and a serious case of sun rash from 20 plus years in the New Mexico sunshine. Wife drives a 06 Acura, 155k miles.

We bought a 2020 Ram 3500 in Jan 21' to move us to another state. The 2000 Tahoe with 300k miles wouldn't have made the trips. The sticker was $76k, we walked out at $71k after employee discount. Drove to for 2 years and 28,000 miles and sold it last spring for $68k. I just couldn't resist taking advantage of the vehicle market and really had no continued need for that much truck.

 We will probably end up with another Tahoe and guarantee someone else will take the depreciation.
 

Bruce » 11 Sep 2023, 2:56 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 2:56 pm

https://www.gm.com/commitments/electrification

https://www.ford.com/electric/

https://www.chrysler.com/chrysler-innov ... rflow.html

———

https://www.tesla.com/Model3

From  $29,740*
After Federal Tax Credit & Est. Gas Savings
 

It's the asterisk, stupid.

RebelGator » 11 Sep 2023, 3:02 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 3:02 pm

And here we have the difference between a sniper and a snipper.

Probably from a lack of snapper. 

Fuelman » 11 Sep 2023, 3:02 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 3:02 pm

More and more people will consider an EV as time goes on. Americans love their vehicles and waste 10's of thousands of dollars in their lifetime to acquire a status symbol (illusion)that fits them. I'm a cheap bastard and always had a hard time buying a depreciating asset. We tend to drive the wheels off our cars. Pretty sure I'm driving the ugliest car right now. Mom's 1998 Subaru Forester, 85k miles, interior mint, body mint, and a serious case of sun rash from 20 plus years in the New Mexico sunshine. Wife drives a 06 Acura, 155k miles.

We bought a 2020 Ram 3500 in Jan 21' to move us to another state. The 2000 Tahoe with 300k miles wouldn't have made the trips. The sticker was $76k, we walked out at $71k after employee discount. Drove to for 2 years and 28,000 miles and sold it last spring for $68k. I just couldn't resist taking advantage of the vehicle market and really had no continued need for that much truck.

 We will probably end up with another Tahoe and guarantee someone else will take the depreciation.

My daily for the last 10 years has been an '08 Tundra and I absolutely love it. Even with 226K on the clock it's still runs like a clock. Before that I had a 2000 Expedition that I got nearly 300k out of.

I have only owned one brand new off the lot vehicle in my life and that was a '91 Ford Ranger that I got off a lot that was liquidating their stock due to tax troubles.

I did kind of like you did with your Ram with it. I drove it two years, put about 30K on it, and sold it for just about what I gave for it.

Ever since then it's been late model used vehicles for me, and drive them til they die. The way this Tundra is going, I'm thinking she's gonna be going for another 100k at least.

Like I said, I certainly won't pass at looking at an EV in the next 6 to 12 months as a replacement for our third, but I'm definitely keeping a gas burner as my primary for the foreseeable future.

 
 

Bruce » 11 Sep 2023, 2:42 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 2:42 pm

To build a new one megawatt capacity wind is stupidly cheaper even than Nat gas plants.

But each night there is hardly any calculation of how much wind energy just goes to waste now from existing wind farms.
 

The largest land based wind farm (and one of the largest wind farms in the world) is the Roscoe Wind Farm near Sweetwater Texas.  It covers 100,000 acres and generates 2,173,566 MWh.  The cost to build was $1 billion in 2009 ($1.419 billion in today's dollars) or $460/MWh...compared to construction cost of $0.82/MWn for a NG plant.  That means wind power cost $460,000/kwh to build and natural gas cost $550/kwh to build.  According the the EIA, operating cost for a wind farm is $0.026/Kwh compared to $0.065/Kwh for a natural gas plant...so the savings from wind takes a few years to kick in.  BTW...last Friday Texas came dangerously close to rolling black-outs...the reason, a dramatic drop in wind the happened around sunset.  Meaning power generation from wind and solar plummeted.

Oh, that largest land based wind farm only provides 20% of the electric demands of TX.

impartialobserver » 11 Sep 2023, 2:52 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 2:52 pm

A limit is a limit. This is not news. These limits have existed for years. If I was to buy an EV (which is on the radar next time we buy a vehicle).. I would be fully aware of these limits and take them into consideration.

NO. "A limit is not a limit" \I took the time to point out what the actual  differences are between a HALF TRUTH and THE WHOLE TRUTH  you serial lying and "whole truth" hating  piece of ****.
It was my pleasure to totally destroy the half truth that you attempted to present to this forum as the whole truth......  
 

ConsRule » 11 Sep 2023, 9:02 am » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 9:02 am

Doesn't address a single issue in the OP.

And tell me, how is the electricity going to those charging stations at WalMart generated?  FYI...the correct answer in the overwhelming majority of the time is fossil fuels.

        Here in Florida, 
after one of our Hurricanes and mass power outages, you can see the EV owners gladly trading their nice Tesla for a Generator and a couple cans of Gas. 

Kobia2 » 11 Sep 2023, 4:06 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 4:06 pm

        Here in Florida, 
after one of our Hurricanes and mass power outages, you can see the EV owners gladly trading their nice Tesla for a Generator and a couple cans of Gas. 

The best way to solve that problem is to have a generator and a couple cans of gas in the garage next to your EV to begin with.

 
 

sootedupCyndi » 11 Sep 2023, 12:08 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 12:08 pm

well- I look at things on my level. Which is real life. and very tiny? But i can add!

I own my gas car! Why would i purchase an EV for a payment of 500 a month??? I could buy a ton of gas for an extra 20 bucks a week.  When the price is high. Do you see the INSANITY Skans?
     

          What I believe is happening is these Electric Vehicles are being mass produced, despite not having the logistics or infrastructure in place to accommodate their numbers, nor the technology to quickly charge them at charging stations --- because they believe this will expedite the phasing out of fossil fuels, even though were are clearly not ready for such a transition... A colossal level of stupidity.. 

Kobia2 » 11 Sep 2023, 4:27 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 4:27 pm

          What I believe is happening is these Electric Vehicles are being mass produced, despite not having the logistics or infrastructure in place to accommodate their numbers, nor the technology to quickly charge them at charging stations --- because they believe this will expedite the phasing out of fossil fuels, even though were are clearly not ready for such a transition... A colossal level of stupidity.. 

 

ConsRule » 11 Sep 2023, 9:02 am » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 9:02 am

Doesn't address a single issue in the OP.

And tell me, how is the electricity going to those charging stations at WalMart generated?  FYI...the correct answer in the overwhelming majority of the time is fossil fuels.

That is such an old and tired cop out.

I can't speak for the charging stations in other states but the ones in my state, the electricity isn't generated by fossil fuel.

We started building one of the largest wind farms in the nation in the 1990s. When it finally came on line it generated more electricity than the existing grid could handle. So we voted once again to raise our taxes to build a new grid. 

We have shutdown all but one coal fire plant and it's being shutdown now. It's out in one of the farming areas of the state. 

The result of all that is that we have more electricity than we use so we sell it to other states for a profit. We have something like the third lowest electric rates in the nation. Our air is much cleaner, we stopped requiring vehicles to be smog checked in 2019 because the air got so much cleaner. We don't have blackouts or brownouts. The only time anyone loses power is if a storm has brought some electrical lines down. 

We get most of our electricity from water. Over 60%. We have a law that requires at least 20% of our electricity comes from alternative and renewable sources. Water isn't considered alternative. 

So the electricity that fuels EV cars here isn't generated by fossil fuels. 

Hybrids, EV and EV/Hybrids are very common here. I would say at least half the cars on the roads here are either Hybrid, EV or combination EV/Hybrid.

Don't buy an EV or hybrid car. They aren't for you. You apparently hate them. 

But stop with the propaganda. Let people make their own choices. 

Taipan » 11 Sep 2023, 12:42 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 12:42 pm

 Here is the trick, silly.
Just make it voluntary. 
Without gov. tax-dollar.           
Do I have to teach you everything ?                     
https://youtu.be/kIufLA7Bx2Q?si=8zxY6ELJleelgqwu

I would be all for that if the government tax dollars also stopped going to the fossil fuel industry.

They've been heavily subsidized for decades. That's on top of all the tax cuts and tax loopholes they get. 

Stop the fossil fuel taxpayer give aways too. 

Low wind turbine pricing has pushed down installed project costs over the last decade. Wind turbine prices are averaging $775 to $850/kilowatt (kW). The average installed cost of wind projects in 2020 was $1,460/kW, down more than 40% since the peak in 2010, though stable for the last three years. The lowest costs were found in Texas.

https://eta.lbl.gov/news/wind-energy-be ... eigh-costs
——-

First, I no more believe man can make the climate hotter than I did in high school believe in a coming ice age, or alien visitations, or mysterious crop circles and animal mutilations or cabals of Satanist pedophiles.

That’s because my Daddy bought me a full set of 1963 World Books in 1962 when I was four.

——
As of January 2022, the U.S. Wind Turbine Database (USWTDB) contains more than 70,800 turbines. These turbines have all been constructed since 1980 in approximately 1,500 wind power projects spanning at least 44 states (plus Puerto Rico and Guam).

https://www.usgs.gov/faqs/how-many-turb ... and%20Guam).

——

New wind turbines have had an average break even cost of two cents a kilowatt now for about five years.

A kilowatt has 3,400 BTU of energy

It costs as little as two cents, wholesale.

The smallest Tesla battery is 50kw. There is an 82 kw option.

If a power utility charges the average rate of 15 cents a kilowatt and the utility only has a cost of 2 cents, then when each night across America there are 200 million electric vehicles charging up, the utilities are going to get as rich as Arab oil sheiks, won’t they?

The environment has **** to do with the enormous profit potential that the EV revolution promises to power companies.

If I sold gasoline I’d hate electric vehicles too.
 
 

GHETTOBLASTER » 11 Sep 2023, 3:35 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 3:35 pm

NO. "A limit is not a limit" \I took the time to point out what the actual  differences are between a HALF TRUTH and THE WHOLE TRUTH  you serial lying and "whole truth" hating  piece of ****.
It was my pleasure to totally destroy the half truth that you attempted to present to this forum as the whole truth......

I would hate to be as angry as you are. You do realize that we are not that far off. I do not own an EV.. guess why? It has limits and I am not going to rely on something that has well publicized limits as my sole vehicle. But.. feel free to spew your vitriol.. there has to be someone that cares about it. 

Kobia2 » 11 Sep 2023, 4:27 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 4:27 pm

          What I believe is happening is these Electric Vehicles are being mass produced, despite not having the logistics or infrastructure in place to accommodate their numbers, nor the technology to quickly charge them at charging stations --- because they believe this will expedite the phasing out of fossil fuels, even though were are clearly not ready for such a transition... A colossal level of stupidity.. 

BINGO...!!!
Big Brother will gain more control over their Goyim Masses than ever before with vehicles that have very limited range  by design and without enough sustained power to pull heavy loads at will.

Bruce » 11 Sep 2023, 5:56 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Sep 2023, 5:56 pm

Low wind turbine pricing has pushed down installed project costs over the last decade. Wind turbine prices are averaging $775 to $850/kilowatt (kW). The average installed cost of wind projects in 2020 was $1,460/kW, down more than 40% since the peak in 2010, though stable for the last three years. The lowest costs were found in Texas.

https://eta.lbl.gov/news/wind-energy-be ... eigh-costs
——-

First, I no more believe man can make the climate hotter than I did in high school believe in a coming ice age, or alien visitations, or mysterious crop circles and animal mutilations or cabals of Satanist pedophiles.

That’s because my Daddy bought me a full set of 1963 World Books in 1962 when I was four.

——
As of January 2022, the U.S. Wind Turbine Database (USWTDB) contains more than 70,800 turbines. These turbines have all been constructed since 1980 in approximately 1,500 wind power projects spanning at least 44 states (plus Puerto Rico and Guam).

https://www.usgs.gov/faqs/how-many-turb ... and%20Guam).

——

New wind turbines have had an average break even cost of two cents a kilowatt now for about five years.

A kilowatt has 3,400 BTU of energy

It costs as little as two cents, wholesale.

The smallest Tesla battery is 50kw. There is an 82 kw option.

If a power utility charges the average rate of 15 cents a kilowatt and the utility only has a cost of 2 cents, then when each night across America there are 200 million electric vehicles charging up, the utilities are going to get as rich as Arab oil sheiks, won’t they?

The environment has **** to do with the enormous profit potential that the EV revolution promises to power companies.

If I sold gasoline I’d hate electric vehicles too.

 you are a one man cabal of satanist pedophilia