Liberal Forum

Sumela » 01 Nov 2023, 10:30 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 10:30 pm

 

        Hahahaha.....
So you're down to manipulating other people's posts?...... Born loser ---- with a dusty suitcase    

jerrab » 01 Nov 2023, 8:13 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 8:13 pm

proving my previous post.

--------------

https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases ... m-families

GENEVA (12 July 2023) – The forced eviction and displacement of the Ghaith-Sub Laban family and many other Palestinian families in east Jerusalem may amount to a war crime of forcible transfer and must be immediately reversed, UN experts* said today.“It is deeply shocking and heartbreaking to see Nora Ghaith and Mustafa Sub Laban, an older Palestinian couple, evicted from their family home where they have lived all their lives and raised their children,” the UN experts said.   Israeli police forcibly evicted Nora Ghaith and Mustafa Sub Laban from their home in the Old City of Jerusalem in the early hours of 11 July. The Ghaith-Sub Laban family, who had a protected lease on the house since 1953, reportedly faced constant harassment and lawsuits from Israeli authorities and settlers seeking to seize their home under an inherently discriminatory law that applies to Palestinians in east Jerusalem.

            
               Psssssst......
Can you find some proof that East Jerusalem is part of Hamas administered Gaza--- ?

Kobia2 » 01 Nov 2023, 10:36 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 10:36 pm

        Hahahaha.....
So you're down to manipulating other people's posts?...... Born loser ---- with a dusty suitcase  

And you have become Cheney....sweet regression    

 

Kobia2 » 01 Nov 2023, 10:25 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 10:25 pm

           Couldn't agree more.....

omi god, queers drink water I hear, I will never drink water again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sumela » 01 Nov 2023, 9:04 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 9:04 pm

WORD.  

They hate Snowden.  They hate Assange.  

And Trumpy murdered a sovereign state's general

who was no threat to the USA. 

Now thats SMALL GUBMT

trump got a bunch of kurds killed, babies too, but no pro lifer complained about that.

Kobia2 » 01 Nov 2023, 5:08 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 5:08 pm

          Spot on....
Hamas intentionally provoked this military response from Israel --- fully knowing the likelihood of a major IDF incursion into Gaza, and how that would impact the population... And as you pointed out, this was in hopes of widening the conflict by drawing in outside support from the Muslim / Arab world.... And rather than protect or fight for the Gazan civilians, Hamas operatives hide behind them, and underneath them as well   --- staging attacks which they know might result in non combatant casualties when the IDF retaliates.... A dead Gazan civilian has far more value than a live one to Hamas..  Their strategy at this point is to hang in as long as they can, hoping  for a Muslim Military intervention --- or pressure from the International Community to get the Israelis onboard with a ceasefire...  Cowards...   

So, what you are saying is that israel - the IDF - is playing right into Hamas' hands. 

I happen to agree with your analysis. 
 

Kobia2 » 01 Nov 2023, 10:38 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 10:38 pm

            
               Psssssst......
Can you find some proof that East Jerusalem is part of Hamas administered Gaza--- ?

... Palestinian uprising against Israeli occupation of the West Bank, Gaza, and East Jerusalem. At the time, Hamas's purpose was to counter Palestinian Islamic 

jerrab » 01 Nov 2023, 11:34 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 11:34 pm

trump got a bunch of kurds killed, babies too, but no pro lifer complained about that.

It was Obama that got them killed, when he armed groups on Turkey's terrorist watch list and funded and instigated them to commit terrorist acts against the peace and dignity of Syria. At the time obama did this, EVERYBOD AND HIS BROTHER knew the Kurds would turn those guns on the Turks, as the Kurds were effectively in revolt against the Turkish government. That's WHY they were on Turkey's list of terrorist organizations. 

Just imagine a fellow NATO member arming anti-US terrorists, to do some dirty for them in Mexico. When the perfectly predictable occurred, that NATO ally would have no choice but to stand aside or engage us militarily. 

Trump's choices - and I am no orange lover - were to engage Turkish troops in combat or stand aside. No American president would have been insane enough to engage in warfare with a fellow NATO member, That is insane. 

The Turks told Trump they were coming - where and when. He made sure that we were not there. 

And mind you, Trump's generals disobeyed him quite regularly. So they obviously agreed with him that it was imperative to get out of the Turks' way. Standing between a NATO ally and a stateless terrorist group that WE ARMED would have been completely off the beam. The mere fact that we armed them in the first place is a big log of **** on US-Turkish relations to this day. Erdogan was not amused by the ***. 
 
 

Cannonpointer » 01 Nov 2023, 11:56 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 11:56 pm

So, what you are saying is that israel - the IDF - is playing right into Hamas' hands. 

I happen to agree with your analysis.

israel was definitely goading hamas and knew that hamas would strike back like it has in the past, hitting  the dog that bites you, now what would the result be?

Kobia2 » 01 Nov 2023, 10:38 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 10:38 pm

jerrab » 01 Nov 2023, 8:13 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Nov 2023, 8:13 pm

GENEVA (12 July 2023) – The forced eviction and displacement of the Ghaith-Sub Laban family and many other Palestinian families in east Jerusalem may amount to a war crime of forcible transfer and must be immediately reversed, UN experts* said today.“It is deeply shocking and heartbreaking to see Nora Ghaith and Mustafa Sub Laban, an older Palestinian couple, evicted from their family home where they have lived all their lives and raised their children,” the UN experts said.   Israeli police forcibly evicted Nora Ghaith and Mustafa Sub Laban from their home in the Old City of Jerusalem in the early hours of 11 July. The Ghaith-Sub Laban family, who had a protected lease on the house since 1953, reportedly faced constant harassment and lawsuits from Israeli authorities and settlers seeking to seize their home under an inherently discriminatory law that applies to Palestinians in east Jerusalem.

               Psssssst......
Can you find some proof that East Jerusalem is part of Hamas administered Gaza--- ?

You cannot defend that apartheid ****, so you latch onto disingenuous wordplay. ANYTHING but the issue. 

HAMAS can object to the treatment of Palis outside of gaza, fruitcake, without being in charge of those areas' administration. 

How about you respond to the issue, which is an elderly couple being evicted by the government from their home of 50 years because of their ethnicity, in order for jewish settlers to steal their property?
 

Cannonpointer » 02 Nov 2023, 12:03 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:03 am

It was Obama that got them killed, when he armed groups on Turkey's terrorist watch list and funded and instigated them to commit terrorist acts against the peace and dignity of Syria. At the time obama did this, EVERYBOD AND HIS BROTHER knew the Kurds would turn those guns on the Turks, as the Kurds were effectively in revolt against the Turkish government. That's WHY they were on Turkey's list of terrorist organizations. 

Just imagine a fellow NATO member arming anti-US terrorists, to do some dirty for them in Mexico. When the perfectly predictable occurred, that NATO ally would have no choice but to stand aside or engage us militarily. 

Trump's choices - and I am no orange lover - were to engage Turkish troops in combat or stand aside. No American president would have been insane enough to engage in warfare with a fellow NATO member, That is insane. 

The Turks told Trump they were coming - where and when. He made sure that we were not there. 

And mind you, Trump's generals disobeyed him quite regularly. So they obviously agreed with him that it was imperative to get out of the Turks' way. Standing between a NATO ally and a stateless terrorist group that WE ARMED would have been completely off the beam. The mere fact that we armed them in the first place is a big log of **** on US-Turkish relations to this day. Erdogan was not amused by the ***.

the kurds in syria were fighting isis, helping the US stop isis, which the kurds did this by hand to hand combat, not bombing whole villages. when isis was defeated and turkey was pissed off at trump for his muslim ban erogan wanted to take trump's name off a hotel so trump made a deal that turkey  could kill all the syrian kurds who were not doing anything but fighting isis. and when the kurds were being massacred and fleeing isis prisoners who were being guarded by the kurds escaped.

jerrab » 02 Nov 2023, 12:06 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:06 am

israel was definitely goading hamas and knew that hamas would strike back like it has in the past, hitting  the dog that bites you, now what would the result be?

Who played into whose hands remains to be determined by the outcome of the conflict. 

That israel's behaviors are at the root is unquestioned. That hamas hoped to okey-doke israel into fronting itself off seems rather clear to me, as well. Who played whom? We shall see. Perhaps the MIC played us all...
 

Cannonpointer » 02 Nov 2023, 12:03 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:03 am

It was Obama that got them killed, when he armed groups on Turkey's terrorist watch list and funded and instigated them to commit terrorist acts against the peace and dignity of Syria. At the time obama did this, EVERYBOD AND HIS BROTHER knew the Kurds would turn those guns on the Turks, as the Kurds were effectively in revolt against the Turkish government. That's WHY they were on Turkey's list of terrorist organizations. 

Just imagine a fellow NATO member arming anti-US terrorists, to do some dirty for them in Mexico. When the perfectly predictable occurred, that NATO ally would have no choice but to stand aside or engage us militarily. 

Trump's choices - and I am no orange lover - were to engage Turkish troops in combat or stand aside. No American president would have been insane enough to engage in warfare with a fellow NATO member, That is insane. 

The Turks told Trump they were coming - where and when. He made sure that we were not there. 

And mind you, Trump's generals disobeyed him quite regularly. So they obviously agreed with him that it was imperative to get out of the Turks' way. Standing between a NATO ally and a stateless terrorist group that WE ARMED would have been completely off the beam. The mere fact that we armed them in the first place is a big log of **** on US-Turkish relations to this day. Erdogan was not amused by the ***.

turkey would not attack as long as american soldiers were there so trump got them removed at turkey's request.

jerrab » 02 Nov 2023, 12:13 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:13 am

the kurds in syria were fighting isis, helping the US stop isis, which the kurds did this by hand to hand combat, not bombing whole villages. when isis was defeated and turkey was pissed off at trump for his muslim ban erogan wanted to take trump's name off a hotel so trump made a deal that turkey  could kill all the syrian kurds who were not doing anything but fighting isis. and when the kurds were being massacred and fleeing isis prisoners who were being guarded by the kurds escaped.

I think you have consumed some propaganda.

To begin with, ISIS (SUNNI) was fighting AGAINST the coalition protecting al Assad, which included Russia (Christian), Iran (Shia), Hezbollah (Shia), and sundry Shia militias. Here is the lineup from the BBC. Notice that ISIS is not mentioned, because the fact that it is a creature and proxy of the US and israel is a hot potato: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-39528673

The Kurds (SUNNI) were with the U.S. in going after al Assad. That is why we armed them. We certainly were not paying the SUNNI Kurds to attack OUR proxy, SUNNI ISIS - though that was the spin because we have to pretend to oppose ISIS.

ISIS is SOMEONE'S PROXY, and operating in that someone's interests - can we agree on that? I say ISIS was America's proxy - which is why Russia destroyed them. Whose proxy do YOU think ISIS is?

If you have no idea who runs ISIS - what major nation state provides the terror group with intel, training, funding, banking services, safe refuge for R&R, safe places for their women and kids - if you do not have any idea what nation provides those necessary things to ISIS, then you might want to realize that you are operating in an information vacuum. If you DO have an idea who funds them now that we originally created, armed and trained them, only to abandon them for unknown reasons, pray tell who might that be? And pray tell when we abandoned them, and why? You DO understand ISIS is al qaeda rebranded, yes? And that al qaeda was OUR proxy when we created it?

 
 

jerrab » 02 Nov 2023, 12:15 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:15 am

turkey would not attack as long as american soldiers were there so trump got them removed at turkey's request.

That is an opinion. We only had a few hundred troops between the turks and the kurds. What the turks might have done is a matter of speculation. Standing between a fellow nato member and a terror group makes sense on no planet in this universal hemisphere of generations going forward anytime now. Tip o' the hat to Omh.
 

Cannonpointer » 02 Nov 2023, 12:35 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:35 am

That is an opinion. We only had a few hundred troops between the turks and the kurds. What the turks might have done is a matter of speculation. Standing between a fellow nato member and a terror group makes sense on no planet in this universal hemisphere of generations going forward anytime now. Tip o' the hat to Omh.

a nato member would not attack US soldiers.

hence the soldiers had to get out of the way.

removed at trump's command.

and the turks came the next minute, no time for the kurds to escape.
 

jerrab » 02 Nov 2023, 12:41 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:41 am

a nato member would not attack US soldiers.

hence the soldiers had to get out of the way.

removed at trump's command.

and the turks came the next minute, no time for the kurds to escape.

That may be true. It was still obama that assured their death when he armed them, knowing they would use those arms against the Turks - knowing that even if the Kurds behaved, the Turks would still not allow armed anti-Turkish terrorists on their porous border in an area populated primarily by ethnic Kurdish citizens dreaming of separation from Turkey and establishing a Kurdish ethno-state.

The Kurds were not our allies. They were our proxies - and proxies are expendable. They were stateless ragamuffins that were happy to get their hands on some guns and money - and they used those guns and money to annoy Erdogan.

Pray explain WHY the Sunni Kurds would want to attack Sunni ISIS - just explain that much to me, since it is clear you have no idea whose proxy ISIS is - but you at least acknowledge that the Kurds were ours. How did we convince them to focus on fighting Sunni ISIS when the field offered tons of Shia militias to shoot at? Hezbollah were there. The Kurds ignored THEM In favor of attacking ISIS? Why would they do that?

 
 

Cannonpointer » 02 Nov 2023, 12:15 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:15 am

Who played into whose hands remains to be determined by the outcome of the conflict. 

That israel's behaviors are at the root is unquestioned. That hamas hoped to okey-doke israel into fronting itself off seems rather clear to me, as well. Who played whom? We shall see. Perhaps the MIC played us all...

israel knew hamas would attack if it did things hamas did not like... fill in the blanks... and the hamas would fire some rockets, giving israel the excuse to fire bombs and bring out the tanks for a month or so, looking like heroes to the world.

they did not expect the massacre on 10-7
 

jerrab » 02 Nov 2023, 12:52 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:52 am

israel knew hamas would attack if it did things hamas did not like... fill in the blanks... and the hamas would fire some rockets, giving israel the excuse to fire bombs and bring out the tanks for a month or so, looking like heroes to the world.

they did not expect the massacre on 10-7

I think the bolded part is widely considered true on both sides of the divide. 
 

Cannonpointer » 02 Nov 2023, 12:49 am » wrote: ↑

02 Nov 2023, 12:49 am

That may be true. It was still obama that assured their death when he armed them, knowing they would use those arms against the Turks.

The Kurds were not our allies. They were our proxies - and proxies are expendable. They were stateless ragamuffins that were happy to get their hands on some guns and money - and they used those guns and money to annoy Erdogan.

Pray explain WHY the Sunni Kurds would want to attack Sunni ISIS - just explain that much to me, since it is clear you have no idea whose proxy ISIS is - but you at least acknowledge that the Kurds were ours. How did we convince them to focus on fighting Sunni ISIS when the field offered tons of Shia militias to shoot at? Hezbollah were there. The Kurds ignored THEM In favor of attacking ISIS? Why would they do that?

no the syrian kurds had no intention of using weapons on turkey,  they would have defeated isis a lot sooner but turkey kept saying not to give weapons tomthe kurds but the kurds never went to turkey, just stayed in syria, fighting isis with american gi's.