Liberal Forum

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 11:01 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:01 am

I'm watching some lectures about modern war.
The speaker was conjecturing about reasons/motives going to war.
One thing he pointed out was NATO is run by committee basically.
Getting a hard, determined choice to declare war is way tougher than a single person in charge.
Referring of course to Putin.

My take-away:
Putin is making choices while NATO "discusses options".
There is no doubt in my mind that if they ever could reach that unanimous mindset,
NATO could bring to bear hellish consequences on their intended target.
Getting all those nations to jump in with both feet requires a traumatic event.

All Putin has to do is tip toe up to that line, but never touch it.
That wrecks NATO's guts. Slows down the "discussion about options".

(Like which shoes to wear. Red stilettos or open-toed pumps?)

Most NATO countries are gutted industrially and militarily.
Russia is in FULL MILITARY INDUSTRIAL mode right now.
Stoltenberg just admitted Friday that the EU CANNOT
MEET UKE arty needs.....

So 30 countries could wreak havoc....on one country?? Maybe some.

Sounds like how *** fight....30 vs 1.  Until Putin melts Berlin and London.

But, I agree, Putin is the ONLY adult in the room.  That much is clear

Sumela » 04 Dec 2023, 11:09 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:09 am

Most NATO countries are gutted industrially and militarily.
Russia is in FULL MILITARY INDUSTRIAL mode right now.
Stoltenberg just admitted Friday that the EU CANNOT
MEET UKE arty needs.....

So 30 countries could wreak havoc....on one country?? Maybe some.

Sounds like how *** fight....30 vs 1.  Until Putin melts Berlin and London.

But, I agree, Putin is the ONLY adult in the room.  That much is clear

I know it isn't fair, but 30 battle apes are frightening . . . even to another battle ape.

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 11:17 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:17 am

I know it isn't fair, but 30 battle apes are frightening . . . even to another battle ape.

Word, it'd get ugly nukie style.

Russia would see that as an imminent and existential threat.

NATO has learned quite a bit the last 20 months, 

mainly that they are weaker than they thought

and that Russia is much stronger than they projected.

But that's typical West hubris.
 

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 11:01 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:01 am

I'm watching some lectures about modern war.
The speaker was conjecturing about reasons/motives going to war.
One thing he pointed out was NATO is run by committee basically.
Getting a hard, determined choice to declare war is way tougher than a single person in charge.
Referring of course to Putin.

My take-away:
Putin is making choices while NATO "discusses options".
There is no doubt in my mind that if they ever could reach that unanimous mindset,
NATO could bring to bear hellish consequences on their intended target.
Getting all those nations to jump in with both feet requires a traumatic event.

All Putin has to do is tip toe up to that line, but never touch it.
That wrecks NATO's guts. Slows down the "discussion about options".

(Like which shoes to wear. Red stilettos or open-toed pumps?)

Russia could hold the line against the NATO nations. Russians know how to suffer. Europeans do not. 

Europeans will cave after the first cold winter. Russians? Not so much. 
 

Sumela » 04 Dec 2023, 11:09 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:09 am

Most NATO countries are gutted industrially and militarily.
Russia is in FULL MILITARY INDUSTRIAL mode right now.
Stoltenberg just admitted Friday that the EU CANNOT
MEET UKE arty needs.....

So 30 countries could wreak havoc....on one country?? Maybe some.

Sounds like how *** fight....30 vs 1.  Until Putin melts Berlin and London.

But, I agree, Putin is the ONLY adult in the room.  That much is clear

If they cannot even supply the proxy they have armed, how the **** will they supply themselves, one wonders.
 

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 11:17 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:17 am

I know it isn't fair, but 30 battle apes are frightening . . . even to another battle ape.

But they are not battle apes. They are corrupted and degraded old women who require an innocent child in order to achieve sexual arousal. 

The countries that cannot supply their kleptocratic proxy do not suddenly become more able to make war materials simply through declaring hostilities.

The truth is, they might be LESS effective as a gang, as there would be a great deal of finger pointing each time some fodder got fed into the fire. 

Imagine a "unified" NATO command (a complete joke - but pretend that could happen). A german division gets wiped out, and the german people screech that their troops are being sacrificed unfairly. Same with the french - or the eastern european nations (not that half of them would even SEND troops - they are fair weather NATO goons at best). The "alliance" is a relic and a bloated chimera that will evaporate the first time it is taxed. Meetings are its bread and butter, not war. 

NATO is a joke. Its primary mission is to provide children for corrupt and senile european aristocrats. And their hunting field for those children is currently being eaten by the slowly advancing red menace. The smartest thing they can do is sue for peace - but there is still money to launder.

Cannonpointer » 04 Dec 2023, 11:38 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:38 am

If they cannot even supply the proxy they have armed, how the **** will they supply themselves, one wonders.

ABSOLUTELY EVERTHING
they thought 20 months ago has been shattered.

-Russia weak militarily.
-Russian economy weak.
-Putin will be overthrown.
-The world will turn against Russia.

Its all 180 degrees the opposite.

But cuckies, once cucked, cant be uncucked.  Or at least its very rare.
 

Cannonpointer » 04 Dec 2023, 11:48 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:48 am

But they are not battle apes. They are corrupted and degraded old women who require an innocent child in order to achieve sexual arousal. 

The countries that cannot supply their kleptocratic proxy do not suddenly become more able to make war materials simply through declaring hostilities.

The truth is, they might be LESS effective as a gang, as there would be a great deal of finger pointing each time some fodder got fed into the fire. 

Imagine a "unified" NATO command (a complete joke - but pretend that could happen). A german division gets wiped out, and the german people screech that their troops are being sacrificed unfairly. Same with the french - or the eastern european nations (not that half of them would even SEND troops - they are fair weather NATO goons at best). The "alliance" is a relic and a bloated chimera that will evaporate the first time it is taxed. Meetings are its bread and butter, not war. 

NATO is a joke. Its primary mission is to provide children for corrupt and senile european aristocrats. And their hunting field for those children is currently being eaten by the slowly advancing red menace. The smartest thing they can do is sue for peace - but there is still money to launder.

You are reinforcing my point.
The beast with 30 heads is, by its very nature, less focused than the single headed beast.
However, a trundling crowd can be powerful too.

Sumela » 04 Dec 2023, 11:28 am » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 11:28 am

Word, it'd get ugly nukie style.

Russia would see that as an imminent and existential threat.

NATO has learned quite a bit the last 20 months, 

mainly that they are weaker than they thought

and that Russia is much stronger than they projected.

But that's typical West hubris.

I read something a few months ago (can't remember where) about fielding troops and equipment.
NATO, that author reckoned, was about the most formidable force of all.

I think the notion that China has at its disposal the largest army, but it is not able to project that group efficiently.

It still gets back to the beast with 30 heads vs the beast with a single head.
NATO probably still thinks moving slowly is thoughtful and deliberate. Not clownish.
Of course, when Russia moves slowly it's weakness...  

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 4:30 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 4:30 pm

I read something a few months ago (can't remember where) about fielding troops and equipment.
NATO, that author reckoned, was about the most formidable force of all.

I think the notion that China has at its disposal the largest army, but it is not able to project that group efficiently.

It still gets back to the beast with 30 heads vs the beast with a single head.
NATO probably still thinks moving slowly is thoughtful and deliberate. Not clownish.
Of course, when Russia moves slowly it's weakness...

Why move at all if the enemy keeps throwing
men and equipment at you.  Its an artillery war.
A war of attrition. Destroying men and equipment is the primary
goal - not taking land.  That comes as a result of attrition.

 

I don't give a damn about Ukraine.

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 4:17 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 4:17 pm

You are reinforcing my point.
The beast with 30 heads is, by its very nature, less focused than the single headed beast.
However, a trundling crowd can be powerful too.

Well, it would be havoc unless the trundling crowd were under a unified command. If not, they would be shooting each other in the fog of war - with 100% probability of that occurring on the regular. And WITH a unified command, you still have the issues I raised: Who cannot arm another cannot arm himself; infighting over who is paying the higher costs and whose trannies are tougher; and refuseniks saying **** that, we're slavs, too - we will sit it out, at best and you're welcome.
 
 
 

murdock » 04 Dec 2023, 5:00 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 5:00 pm

I don't give a damn about Ukraine.

Your mom does. She gets gang-banged by uki soldiers on leave.
 
 

Cannonpointer » 04 Dec 2023, 5:16 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 5:16 pm

Your mom does. She gets gag banged by uki soldiers on leave.

No wonder Murdy is so deranged.....with a mom like this.

  
 
 

Cannonpointer » 04 Dec 2023, 5:16 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 5:16 pm

Your mom does. She gets gag banged by uki soldiers on leave.
 

No, that's cock savings mom.

Sumela » 04 Dec 2023, 5:18 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 5:18 pm

No wonder Murdy is so deranged.....with a mom like this.

  
 
 

No that's cock savers mom.

Sumela » 04 Dec 2023, 5:18 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 5:18 pm

No wonder Murdy is so deranged.....with a mom like this.

  

How in the hell did you get over 2000's greenies... hilarious! ha ha ha... giggle.
 

Sumela » 03 Dec 2023, 4:40 pm » wrote: ↑

03 Dec 2023, 4:40 pm

Mark Sleboda reposted
Zlatti71@djuric_zlatko

 Stoltenberg believes that one should prepare for bad news from Ukraine. He expressed this point of view on Saturday in an interview with the ARD television channel. We must also be prepared for bad news,” said the Secretary General of the North Atlantic Alliance, answering the question of whether he fears that the situation in Ukraine will worsen in the future. “Wars develop in stages. But we must support Ukraine in good and bad times,” he said. Increasing ammunition production, according to Stoltenberg, is crucial. At the same time, he admitted that NATO countries were unable to meet the increased demand for ammuniton.

Ukraine, the Secretary-General believes, is in a “critical situation.” However, he did not answer the question of how the command in Kiev should act in such a situation. “I will leave these difficult operational decisions to the discretion of the Ukrainians and military leaders,” Stoltenberg said.

IF this is true, and the spigots are being turned OFF for the time being... then Ukraine needs to:

1)  Conserve the Tanks and armored vehicles they have...
2)  Conserve the anti tank and anti aircraft munitions they have...
3)  Start digging into lines they are currently in,
4)  Ask the west for MILLIONS of rounds of small arms ammo... and
5)  PREPARE for a LONG WAR !!

NO ONE ever said this was going to be easy... BUT, Russia as a LONG way from winning thsi war... and have lost a LOT of blood and treasure getting to this point...  Lets see is they are prepared to loose TWICE as many over the next couple years. 

I don't think MOST of the Ruski's get it.. The UKES dont WANT to be part of the Russian CABAL... NO ONE WANTS to be part of the Russian Cabal !

It just might be time now,,, that they SHOW the WORLD hoe MUCH they don't want it !

DeezerShoove » 04 Dec 2023, 4:30 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 4:30 pm

Of course, when Russia moves slowly it's weakness...

Their enemies keep getting stupider looking for the world to see, and their map keeps expanding. I guess they've done the necessary plebiscites to absorb the regions they've rolled through, and of course the ethnic russian majority voted to be states within the russian federation of states. So there's that - at the end of this war, ukraine will remain as diminished as it is today in a best case scenario. 

They lost 2.5% of their GDP year over year because of western sanctions. Meanwhile, Germany is beating off to those numbers, wondering how wonderful that must feel. Their economy "grew" by just under 2% - unless you check in with PPP (yeah, you know me). According to the world bank, the ranking of Germany’s economy among the top higher-rate countries has fallen down to the sixth row in terms of the GDP (of PPP) index by the end of 2022. Having their ally blow their **** up was a painful blow to absorb. Hurt the Russians, too, no doubt. Everybody has to pay, right? And Ukraine most of all. 

Yeah, Russia just keeps weakly rolling along lol. They took an area bigger than oklahoma and with 9-10 million people - 15-20% of ukraine's original territory if you include Crimea and its two and a half million people.
 

sootedupCyndi » 04 Dec 2023, 5:32 pm » wrote: ↑

04 Dec 2023, 5:32 pm

How in the hell did you get over 2000's greenies... hilarious! ha ha ha... giggle.