Liberal Forum

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 8:57 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 8:57 am

The US has no allies in the middle east!!! ALL mooslimes hate the US and western way of life and if given the chance will kill infidels.

they have been american allies for a long time
------------------------------------

https://www.npr.org/2019/10/10/76904481 ... -the-kurds

WAHAB: The Kurds don't have a state even today, and they never had an army to participate in World War II. But anecdotally, there were Kurdish soldiers who fought the Nazis in Germany alongside the British army, for example. But there were also Kurdish soldiers fighting the Nazi-supported Iraqi government.
 

jerrab » 18 Jan 2024, 8:59 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 8:59 am

**** the kurds were american allies, but trump betrayed them.

Again, your lack of understanding, simpleton:
"Turkey has been America’s ally under the North Atlantic Treaty since 1952. It has the second-largest military in NATO and hosts American military service members, aircraft and nuclear weapons at bases that allow the U.S. to project force in the Middle East. It is also an unquestionably difficult partner. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has fundamentally transformed the secular, democratic state that Mustafa Kemal Ataturk established in 1923 into an illiberal democracy. Erdogan’s repression of basic democratic rights might be easier for Washington to overlook if he weren’t simultaneously putting the longstanding U.S.-Turkey strategic defense relationship at jeopardy, such as by procuring a Russian-made missile defense system designed to shoot down NATO aircraft.

President Barack Obama found Turkey to be especially prickly and unhelpful in addressing the rise of ISIS. By many accounts, Erdogan turned a blind eye to the flow of jihadists into Syria through Turkey’s southern border. Ankara was more concerned about bringing down Bashar Assad and fighting the Syrian Kurds than it was with threat of ISIS.

Turkey’s concern over the Kurds is not unfounded, however. The Kurdish Worker’s Party (PKK) has killed nearly 40,000 people in Turkey since the 1980s, when that Kurdish Marxist-Leninist group began its guerrilla war against the Turkish state. Both Turkey and the U.S. have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The Syrian YPG is an offshoot of the PKK, from which it receives training, arms, funding and other support.

The Obama administration chose to partner with the YPG, despite Turkey’s legitimate security concerns, in what it dubbed a short-term, tactical relationship to root out ISIS. In so doing, the U.S. abandoned its ally, the Turks, in favor of a group practically indistinguishable from the PPK, which Washington and Ankara deem a terrorist group. It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."
The Kurds are not our allies (but Turkey is) (startribune.com)

BUT.. BUT... BUT... REPUBLICANS ARE A THREAT TO DEMOCRACY!!!!!        
 

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am

Again, your lack of understanding, simpleton:
"Turkey has been America’s ally under the North Atlantic Treaty since 1952. It has the second-largest military in NATO and hosts American military service members, aircraft and nuclear weapons at bases that allow the U.S. to project force in the Middle East. It is also an unquestionably difficult partner. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has fundamentally transformed the secular, democratic state that Mustafa Kemal Ataturk established in 1923 into an illiberal democracy. Erdogan’s repression of basic democratic rights might be easier for Washington to overlook if he weren’t simultaneously putting the longstanding U.S.-Turkey strategic defense relationship at jeopardy, such as by procuring a Russian-made missile defense system designed to shoot down NATO aircraft.

President Barack Obama found Turkey to be especially prickly and unhelpful in addressing the rise of ISIS. By many accounts, Erdogan turned a blind eye to the flow of jihadists into Syria through Turkey’s southern border. Ankara was more concerned about bringing down Bashar Assad and fighting the Syrian Kurds than it was with threat of ISIS.

Turkey’s concern over the Kurds is not unfounded, however. The Kurdish Worker’s Party (PKK) has killed nearly 40,000 people in Turkey since the 1980s, when that Kurdish Marxist-Leninist group began its guerrilla war against the Turkish state. Both Turkey and the U.S. have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The Syrian YPG is an offshoot of the PKK, from which it receives training, arms, funding and other support.

The Obama administration chose to partner with the YPG, despite Turkey’s legitimate security concerns, in what it dubbed a short-term, tactical relationship to root out ISIS. In so doing, the U.S. abandoned its ally, the Turks, in favor of a group practically indistinguishable from the PPK, which Washington and Ankara deem a terrorist group. It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."
The Kurds are not our allies (but Turkey is) (startribune.com)

the kurds fighting isis in syria was not part of pkk.

and trump could have given them time to move instead of having turkey slaughter them. that is what a christian would have done.

Warcok » 18 Jan 2024, 9:34 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:34 am

BUT.. BUT... BUT... REPUBLICANS ARE A THREAT TO DEMOCRACY!!!!!      

So, the oh so democratic (NOT!!!) dim-0-craps are planning on using the military to pull off a coup when Trump is reelected.

Who is the real threat to democracy?  We are witnessing that threat with braindead biden and his incompetent administration of queers, trannys and ***' third world banana republic style persecution of Trump and his allies in an effort to keep him from being elected again because they know that braindead biden cannot beat him in a fair and fraudulent free November election.

 
 

jerrab » 18 Jan 2024, 9:41 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:41 am

the kurds fighting isis in syria was not part of pkk.

and trump could have given them time to move instead of having turkey slaughter them. that is what a christian would have done.

To live and fight another day against Turkey, eh?
 

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am

Again, your lack of understanding, simpleton:
"Turkey has been America’s ally under the North Atlantic Treaty since 1952. It has the second-largest military in NATO and hosts American military service members, aircraft and nuclear weapons at bases that allow the U.S. to project force in the Middle East. It is also an unquestionably difficult partner. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has fundamentally transformed the secular, democratic state that Mustafa Kemal Ataturk established in 1923 into an illiberal democracy. Erdogan’s repression of basic democratic rights might be easier for Washington to overlook if he weren’t simultaneously putting the longstanding U.S.-Turkey strategic defense relationship at jeopardy, such as by procuring a Russian-made missile defense system designed to shoot down NATO aircraft.

President Barack Obama found Turkey to be especially prickly and unhelpful in addressing the rise of ISIS. By many accounts, Erdogan turned a blind eye to the flow of jihadists into Syria through Turkey’s southern border. Ankara was more concerned about bringing down Bashar Assad and fighting the Syrian Kurds than it was with threat of ISIS.

Turkey’s concern over the Kurds is not unfounded, however. The Kurdish Worker’s Party (PKK) has killed nearly 40,000 people in Turkey since the 1980s, when that Kurdish Marxist-Leninist group began its guerrilla war against the Turkish state. Both Turkey and the U.S. have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The Syrian YPG is an offshoot of the PKK, from which it receives training, arms, funding and other support.

The Obama administration chose to partner with the YPG, despite Turkey’s legitimate security concerns, in what it dubbed a short-term, tactical relationship to root out ISIS. In so doing, the U.S. abandoned its ally, the Turks, in favor of a group practically indistinguishable from the PPK, which Washington and Ankara deem a terrorist group. It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."
The Kurds are not our allies (but Turkey is) (startribune.com)

allies all over the world was shocked by what trump did.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-50181855
The first time I saw an American in Syria was in 2016. He was part of US special forces, sent to support the Kurds fighting the Islamic State (IS) group. Locals were excited to see them arriving.But it was in stark contrast this time around. Now you could see the fear and anxiety in the faces of onlookers.We were only a few kilometres from the Turkish border as one of the jets circled overhead, leaving a trail of white smoke as it passed in and out of Turkish airspace.One of our guides sighed. "Trump bi namoose," he said to me in Kurdish. "Trump has no honour."

 
 

Warcok » 18 Jan 2024, 9:34 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:34 am

BUT.. BUT... BUT... REPUBLICANS ARE A THREAT TO DEMOCRACY!!!!!      

trump is.

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:42 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:42 am

So, the oh so democratic (NOT!!!) dim-0-craps are planning on using the military to pull off a coup when Trump is reelected.

Who is the real threat to democracy?  We are witnessing that threat with braindead biden and his incompetent administration of queers, trannys and ***' third world banana republic style persecution of Trump and his allies in an effort to keep him from being elected again because they know that braindead biden cannot beat him in a fair and fraudulent free November election.

you are full of ****. making up lies just like trump.

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:44 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:44 am

To live and fight another day against Turkey, eh?

the syrian kurds never fought turkey.
 

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am

Again, your lack of understanding, simpleton:
"Turkey has been America’s ally under the North Atlantic Treaty since 1952. It has the second-largest military in NATO and hosts American military service members, aircraft and nuclear weapons at bases that allow the U.S. to project force in the Middle East. It is also an unquestionably difficult partner. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has fundamentally transformed the secular, democratic state that Mustafa Kemal Ataturk established in 1923 into an illiberal democracy. Erdogan’s repression of basic democratic rights might be easier for Washington to overlook if he weren’t simultaneously putting the longstanding U.S.-Turkey strategic defense relationship at jeopardy, such as by procuring a Russian-made missile defense system designed to shoot down NATO aircraft.

President Barack Obama found Turkey to be especially prickly and unhelpful in addressing the rise of ISIS. By many accounts, Erdogan turned a blind eye to the flow of jihadists into Syria through Turkey’s southern border. Ankara was more concerned about bringing down Bashar Assad and fighting the Syrian Kurds than it was with threat of ISIS.

Turkey’s concern over the Kurds is not unfounded, however. The Kurdish Worker’s Party (PKK) has killed nearly 40,000 people in Turkey since the 1980s, when that Kurdish Marxist-Leninist group began its guerrilla war against the Turkish state. Both Turkey and the U.S. have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The Syrian YPG is an offshoot of the PKK, from which it receives training, arms, funding and other support.

The Obama administration chose to partner with the YPG, despite Turkey’s legitimate security concerns, in what it dubbed a short-term, tactical relationship to root out ISIS. In so doing, the U.S. abandoned its ally, the Turks, in favor of a group practically indistinguishable from the PPK, which Washington and Ankara deem a terrorist group. It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."
The Kurds are not our allies (but Turkey is) (startribune.com)

all american allies were shocked at what  trump did.

https://youtu.be/oRukAwCnusg?si=g4EcEP75_5ly1AzK

 

For what it’s worth

I remember these two legends of journalism talking about that when it happened 

from the gray zone

these are journalists that actually went to Syria to see for themselves 

not that anyone will watch

https://youtu.be/IjSnPMCch3g?si=DkbTZTpFVj51O7P4
 

jerrab » 18 Jan 2024, 10:03 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 10:03 am

all american allies were shocked at what  trump did.

https://youtu.be/oRukAwCnusg?si=g4EcEP75_5ly1AzK

"It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."

THAT was on the magic negro!!!
 

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am

Again, your lack of understanding, simpleton:
"Turkey has been America’s ally under the North Atlantic Treaty since 1952. It has the second-largest military in NATO and hosts American military service members, aircraft and nuclear weapons at bases that allow the U.S. to project force in the Middle East. It is also an unquestionably difficult partner. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has fundamentally transformed the secular, democratic state that Mustafa Kemal Ataturk established in 1923 into an illiberal democracy. Erdogan’s repression of basic democratic rights might be easier for Washington to overlook if he weren’t simultaneously putting the longstanding U.S.-Turkey strategic defense relationship at jeopardy, such as by procuring a Russian-made missile defense system designed to shoot down NATO aircraft.

President Barack Obama found Turkey to be especially prickly and unhelpful in addressing the rise of ISIS. By many accounts, Erdogan turned a blind eye to the flow of jihadists into Syria through Turkey’s southern border. Ankara was more concerned about bringing down Bashar Assad and fighting the Syrian Kurds than it was with threat of ISIS.

Turkey’s concern over the Kurds is not unfounded, however. The Kurdish Worker’s Party (PKK) has killed nearly 40,000 people in Turkey since the 1980s, when that Kurdish Marxist-Leninist group began its guerrilla war against the Turkish state. Both Turkey and the U.S. have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The Syrian YPG is an offshoot of the PKK, from which it receives training, arms, funding and other support.

The Obama administration chose to partner with the YPG, despite Turkey’s legitimate security concerns, in what it dubbed a short-term, tactical relationship to root out ISIS. In so doing, the U.S. abandoned its ally, the Turks, in favor of a group practically indistinguishable from the PPK, which Washington and Ankara deem a terrorist group. It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."
The Kurds are not our allies (but Turkey is) (startribune.com)

----------------------------------------

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump ... 8be868d2e5

The announcement threw the military situation in Syria into fresh chaos and injected deeper uncertainty into U.S. relations with European allies. A French official, speaking on condition of anonymity on a sensitive topic, said France wasn’t informed ahead of time. A Foreign Ministry statement warned Turkey to avoid any action that would harm the international coalition against the Islamic State and noted the Kurds had been essential allies. It entirely omitted any mention of the United States.
 

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 10:10 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 10:10 am

"It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."

THAT was on the magic negro!!!

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump ... 8be868d2e5

The announcement threw the military situation in Syria into fresh chaos and injected deeper uncertainty into U.S. relations with European allies. A French official, speaking on condition of anonymity on a sensitive topic, said France wasn’t informed ahead of time
 

jerrab » 18 Jan 2024, 10:01 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 10:01 am

the syrian kurds never fought turkey.

It is more complicated than that, simpleton!!!

"The PKK, designated a terrorist group by Turkey, the United States and the European Union, took up arms against the Turkish state in 1984. More than 40,000 people have been killed in the insurgency.

The conflict was long fought mainly in rural areas of southeastern Turkey but is now more focused on the mountains of northern Iraq's semi-autonomous Kurdistan region, where PKK militants are based.

Interior Minister Ali Yerlikaya said on social media platform X that counter-terrorism police had also detained 165 people in operations targeting the PKK across 28 Turkish provinces."

Turkey strikes Kurdish militants in Iraq and Syria | Reuters
 

jerrab » 18 Jan 2024, 10:17 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 10:17 am

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump ... 8be868d2e5

The announcement threw the military situation in Syria into fresh chaos and injected deeper uncertainty into U.S. relations with European allies. A French official, speaking on condition of anonymity on a sensitive topic, said France wasn’t informed ahead of time

IOW, Trump quit wasting taxpayer money on a conflict that is 1000's of years old and France, et al, are pissed.  Who gives a ****?  Let them fight and foot the bill!!!
 
 

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 9:12 am

Again, your lack of understanding, simpleton:
"Turkey has been America’s ally under the North Atlantic Treaty since 1952. It has the second-largest military in NATO and hosts American military service members, aircraft and nuclear weapons at bases that allow the U.S. to project force in the Middle East. It is also an unquestionably difficult partner. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has fundamentally transformed the secular, democratic state that Mustafa Kemal Ataturk established in 1923 into an illiberal democracy. Erdogan’s repression of basic democratic rights might be easier for Washington to overlook if he weren’t simultaneously putting the longstanding U.S.-Turkey strategic defense relationship at jeopardy, such as by procuring a Russian-made missile defense system designed to shoot down NATO aircraft.

President Barack Obama found Turkey to be especially prickly and unhelpful in addressing the rise of ISIS. By many accounts, Erdogan turned a blind eye to the flow of jihadists into Syria through Turkey’s southern border. Ankara was more concerned about bringing down Bashar Assad and fighting the Syrian Kurds than it was with threat of ISIS.

Turkey’s concern over the Kurds is not unfounded, however. The Kurdish Worker’s Party (PKK) has killed nearly 40,000 people in Turkey since the 1980s, when that Kurdish Marxist-Leninist group began its guerrilla war against the Turkish state. Both Turkey and the U.S. have designated the PKK a terrorist organization. The Syrian YPG is an offshoot of the PKK, from which it receives training, arms, funding and other support.

The Obama administration chose to partner with the YPG, despite Turkey’s legitimate security concerns, in what it dubbed a short-term, tactical relationship to root out ISIS. In so doing, the U.S. abandoned its ally, the Turks, in favor of a group practically indistinguishable from the PPK, which Washington and Ankara deem a terrorist group. It is therefore troubling — and entirely hypocritical — to hear politicians like U.S. Rep. Dean Phillips, D-Minn., say that the decision to abandon the Kurds is a betrayal of our allies. On the contrary, our long-term strategic ally, Turkey, was abandoned when we worked with the Kurds in Syria."
The Kurds are not our allies (but Turkey is) (startribune.com)

yep, trump cares so much about american allies- lol--------------------

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/urgent- ... d=65841487


Urgent new warnings about ISIS fighter jailbreaks, as Trump threatens Europe with releasing them
 
 

jerrab » 18 Jan 2024, 10:00 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 10:00 am

you are full of ****. making up lies just like trump.

That is not what NBC said, ****!!!

 NBC News reports:

Donald Trump is sparking fears among those who understand the inner workings of the Pentagon that he would convert the nonpartisan U.S. military into the muscular arm of his political agenda as he makes comments about dictatorship and devalues the checks and balances that underpin the nation’s two-century-old democracy.A circle of appointees independent of Trump’s political operation steered him away from ideas that would have pushed the limits of presidential power in his last term, according to books they’ve written and testimony given to Congress. Most were gone by the end. In a new term, many former officials worry that Trump would instead surround himself with loyalists unwilling to say no.Trump has raised fresh questions about his intentions if he regains power by putting forward a legal theory that a president would be free to do nearly anything with impunity — including assassinate political rivals — so long as Congress can’t muster the votes to impeach him and throw him out of office.Now, bracing for Trump’s potential return, a loose-knit network of public interest groups and lawmakers is quietly devising plans to try to foil any efforts to expand presidential power, which could include pressuring the military to cater to his political needs.Those taking part in the effort told NBC News they are studying Trump’s past actions and 2024 policy positions so that they will be ready if he wins in November. That involves preparing to take legal action and send letters to Trump appointees spelling out consequences they’d face if they undermine constitutional norms.

Critics argue that preemptive measures to curtail such use are tantamount to unconstitutional acts and may pave the way for a “military coup” to subvert the will of the American people.

Buffalo » 18 Jan 2024, 10:28 am » wrote: ↑

18 Jan 2024, 10:28 am

That is not what NBC said, ****!!!

 NBC News reports:

Critics argue that preemptive measures to curtail such use are tantamount to unconstitutional acts and may pave the way for a “military coup” to subvert the will of the American people.

your brain is obviously fried.