Liberal Forum

jerrab » 27 Oct 2024, 11:43 am » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 11:43 am

from what I can see people in other countries are more angered by what is going on in israel than americans..

bombins don't even get a mention on the news hardly anymore.

Useful idiots
 

Zeets2 » 27 Oct 2024, 10:01 am » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 10:01 am

Sorry, I disagree.
I don't believe there has EVER been an Israeli policy to exterminate ANY race or religion.  They, more than any other race know better what it's like to have a pogram of extermination against them, and they recognize how that bias continues uninterrupted today.  They are understandably wary today of how that hatred can quickly be manifested against them, as they are virtually surrounded by countries that have repeatedly waged war against them for the same purpose that Hitler and Nazi Germany had.

Explained: Likud ideology is based on Israeli occupation of West Bank, Gaza

PM Netanyahu displayed a map showing Israel from the sea to the river without any Palestine. He was merely echoing his party’s official stance.

https://www.trtworld.com/magazine/expla ... a-18206457

Educate yourself ...first.
Then comment...

 
 

Majik » 27 Oct 2024, 12:00 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 12:00 pm

Explained: Likud ideology is based on Israeli occupation of West Bank, Gaza

PM Netanyahu displayed a map showing Israel from the sea to the river without any Palestine. He was merely echoing his party’s official stance.

https://www.trtworld.com/magazine/expla ... a-18206457

Educate yourself ...first.
Then comment...

Zero chance of him doing that

He knows what he has been told

Nothing else
 

Mrkelly » 27 Oct 2024, 12:03 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 12:03 pm

Zero chance of him doing that

He knows what he has been told

Nothing else

Not "told" ....
Programmed .....
If he were just "told" then he wouldn't be rejecting reality...

Majik » 27 Oct 2024, 12:00 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 12:00 pm

Explained: Likud ideology is based on Israeli occupation of West Bank, Gaza

PM Netanyahu displayed a map showing Israel from the sea to the river without any Palestine. He was merely echoing his party’s official stance.

https://www.trtworld.com/magazine/expla ... a-18206457

Educate yourself ...first.
Then comment...

The only question is, why on earth would Israel EVER choose to consider giving up their autonomy over Palestine when it has bee proven year after year and decade after decade that they have no intention of EVER living peacefully alongside Israel?
NO country would be dumb enough to accept such an arrangement when every attempt at peaceful co-existence has been met with terrorism and war in response.

Prove to Israel over a decade or two that the Palestinians CAN govern themselves peacefully in Gaza and accept Israel by voting in a government that does not have the total destruction of Israel in their charter and then they have EARNED the right to govern themselves in peace.  It has been proven over the past 80 years that continued aggression against them doesn't work to achieve that goal, so how long do you think it will take for them to get the message that another way must be tried?  Those past 80 years have been worthless to them since they've failed to learn that, and the result is that they are worse off now then they were 80 years ago.

Some people just refuse to learn anything from history and as a result, their plight will never be resolved.  When they opt for war over peace every time, then that's exactly what they'll get every time, and they've got no right to expect anything different.
 

Zeets2 » 27 Oct 2024, 12:53 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 12:53 pm

The only question is, why on earth would Israel EVER choose to consider giving up their autonomy over Palestine when it has bee proven year after year and decade after decade that they have no intention of EVER living peacefully alongside Israel?
NO country would be dumb enough to accept such an arrangement when every attempt at peaceful co-existence has been met with terrorism and war in response.

Prove to Israel over a decade or two that the Palestinians CAN govern themselves peacefully in Gaza and accept Israel by voting in a government that does not have the total destruction of Israel in their charter and then they have EARNED the right to govern themselves in peace.  It has been proven over the past 80 years that continued aggression against them doesn't work to achieve that goal, so how long do you think it will take for them to get the message that another way must be tried?  Those past 80 years have been worthless to them since they've failed to learn that, and the result is that they are worse off now then they were 80 years ago.

Some people just refuse to learn anything from history and as a result, their plight will never be resolved.  When they opt for war over peace every time, then that's exactly what they'll get every time, and they've got no right to expect anything different.

Because there autonomy over Palestine is illegal under international law.....and always has been.
and let' s be honest here .....
The West Bank and Gaza is treated as an open air concentration camp by the Israeli's whom have segregated them....for decades now....

Do you believe that Israel would be able to get away with what they are doing if it weren't for The US protecting them and their genocide ?
And what does that say to the rest of the world regarding our hypocrisy ?

 
 

Majik » 27 Oct 2024, 2:08 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 2:08 pm

Because there autonomy over Palestine is illegal under international law.....and always has been.
and let' s be honest here .....
The West Bank and Gaza is treated as an open air concentration camp by the Israeli's whom have segregated them....for decades now....

Do you believe that Israel would be able to get away with what they are doing if it weren't for The US protecting them and their genocide ?
And what does that say to the rest of the world regarding our hypocrisy ?

Of course Israel couldn't survive without our help.  But don't look at that as just a one-way street.  The US has an excellent strategic ally in that which is the most hostile region of the world, and having that benefits us greatly.  We also enjoy a permanent partner with Israel who has no problem taking on the terrorism that's fomented by Iran, Lebanon, Somalia, and Yemen, where we have since been enjoined by Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, the UAE, Oman, and Qatar, all which were once unified against Israel but have now agreed to accept and trade with them, and in doing so created a closer alliance with the US as well.  I can even see Saudi Arabia joining that group in the near future under Trump, limiting further the extension of peace in the area.  And depending upon how badly Israel decimates Hezbollah in Lebanon, there's always the hope that even they can renounce terrorism and recognize the benefits of bettering trade relations within that group, isolating Iran much further.

I see no reason to continue claiming that the Israeli purpose is to inflict genocide on Palestine.  At some point, and quite possibly in the very near future when Hamas is completely destroyed and Gaza has to elect new leaders, there will be an opportunity to bring peace between them as well.  If instead they choose to continue launching rockets and missiles at Israel every day under a new government that maintains the same charter as Hamas calling for the destruction of Israel, I wouldn't expect anything to change in the foreseeable future.

While you and others continue to blame Israel for what has transpired and forced them to defend themselves, I see the only chance for peace lies in the hands of Gaza itself.  And I'm quite comfortable leaving the choices to Israel about how best to maintain their own security.
 

Zeets2 » 27 Oct 2024, 2:36 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 2:36 pm

Of course Israel couldn't survive without our help.  But don't look at that as just a one-way street.  The US has an excellent strategic ally in that which is the most hostile region of the world, and having that benefits us greatly.  We also enjoy a permanent partner with Israel who has no problem taking on the terrorism that's fomented by Iran, Lebanon, Somalia, and Yemen, where we have since been enjoined by Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, the UAE, Oman, and Qatar, all which were once unified against Israel but have now agreed to accept and trade with them, and in doing so created a closer alliance with the US as well.  I can even see Saudi Arabia joining that group in the near future under Trump, limiting further the extension of peace in the area.  And depending upon how badly Israel decimates Hezbollah in Lebanon, there's always the hope that even they can renounce terrorism and recognize the benefits of bettering trade relations within that group, isolating Iran much further.

I see no reason to continue claiming that the Israeli purpose is to inflict genocide on Palestine.  At some point, and quite possibly in the very near future when Hamas is completely destroyed and Gaza has to elect new leaders, there will be an opportunity to bring peace between them as well.  If instead they choose to continue launching rockets and missiles at Israel every day under a new government that maintains the same charter as Hamas calling for the destruction of Israel, I wouldn't expect anything to change in the foreseeable future.

While you and others continue to blame Israel for what has transpired and forced them to defend themselves, I see the only chance for peace lies in the hands of Gaza itself.  And I'm quite comfortable leaving the choices to Israel about how best to maintain their own security.

the reason it is  a hostile area is because for decades the us has been protecting israel and allowing israel do what it ever wants in gaza or palestine.

Zeets2 » 27 Oct 2024, 2:36 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 2:36 pm

Of course Israel couldn't survive without our help.  But don't look at that as just a one-way street.  The US has an excellent strategic ally in that which is the most hostile region of the world, and having that benefits us greatly.  We also enjoy a permanent partner with Israel who has no problem taking on the terrorism that's fomented by Iran, Lebanon, Somalia, and Yemen, where we have since been enjoined by Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, the UAE, Oman, and Qatar, all which were once unified against Israel but have now agreed to accept and trade with them, and in doing so created a closer alliance with the US as well.  I can even see Saudi Arabia joining that group in the near future under Trump, limiting further the extension of peace in the area.  And depending upon how badly Israel decimates Hezbollah in Lebanon, there's always the hope that even they can renounce terrorism and recognize the benefits of bettering trade relations within that group, isolating Iran much further.

I see no reason to continue claiming that the Israeli purpose is to inflict genocide on Palestine.  At some point, and quite possibly in the very near future when Hamas is completely destroyed and Gaza has to elect new leaders, there will be an opportunity to bring peace between them as well.  If instead they choose to continue launching rockets and missiles at Israel every day under a new government that maintains the same charter as Hamas calling for the destruction of Israel, I wouldn't expect anything to change in the foreseeable future.

While you and others continue to blame Israel for what has transpired and forced them to defend themselves, I see the only chance for peace lies in the hands of Gaza itself.  And I'm quite comfortable leaving the choices to Israel about how best to maintain their own security.

I'M afraid when it comes to this subject there is really no hope for you ....
Do you really believe that the Palestinians after suffering mass starvation and genocide at the hands of the Israelis will now miraculously want Peace ?
Netanayhu has destroyed any chance of that now....
and he has also ensured Israel's future fate as a true pariah state in the eyes of the majority of the world .







 

Zeets2 » 27 Oct 2024, 10:51 am » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 10:51 am

If your idiotic opinion was in any way accurate, then why haven't both Israeli and US soldiers faced charges of murder, you nitwit?

 

From whom, jaggov?

Zeets2 » 27 Oct 2024, 10:44 am » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 10:44 am

Call it whatever you like, Nazi, but answer just one question:

Did the Palestinians overwhelmingly vote for and elect Hama to lead them in the last free election they held in 2006 or not?
 

No. Hamas won by the thinnest of margins, and only because of the millions they got from israeli intelligence. 

Thanks for asking, you stupid ****.

Majik » 27 Oct 2024, 3:14 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 3:14 pm

I'M afraid when it comes to this subject there is really no hope for you ....
Do you really believe that the Palestinians after suffering mass starvation and genocide at the hands of the Israelis will now miraculously want Peace ?
Netanayhu has destroyed any chance of that now....
and he has also ensured Israel's future fate as a true pariah state in the eyes of the majority of the world .

I really don't see how any hope is necessary on either side of the debate.
Do you really expect Israeli policy to change based on how much you despise it?
Or could you possibly fathom a scenario where I change my opinion on it and would stop supporting Israel as the wipe out Hamas and Hezbollah terrorists or retaliate against Iran?
So what do either of us require "hope" for?

And if Palestinians don't learn their lesson from having their choice of Hamas' terrorists as their leaders, then yes they will continue to suffer for that decision.  That's fine by me!  If, as you say, they will not want peace now, then what makes you think that Israel will not continue to fight and destroy any further terrorist attempts that a new Gaza government will use against them?  The simple truth is that nothing will change IF the people of Gaza choose a new terrorist government like Hamas to lead them rather than a government that is willing to recognize Israel legitimacy and peacefully co-exist with them.  Some people simply refuse to learn from history to their own detriment.

Do you really think Israel (or me for that matter) care if those like you look at them as a pariah state, when that's exactly what they've faced for the past 80 years?  How is it that you think it will bring about any change now?
 

Cannonpointer » 27 Oct 2024, 11:52 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 11:52 pm

No. Hamas won by the thinnest of margins, and only because of the millions they got from israeli intelligence. 

Thanks for asking, you stupid ****.

The "thinnest of margins", huh?
Is that what a dope like you considers it when Hamas won 74 out of 132 seats of government in 2006?
That's actually a victory that works out to be a margin of 56% of the government seats, and you call that "thin"?!?

Wouldn't you call it a landslide victory if Trump wins 56% of the vote next week?
Use your head for a change nitwit, unless you're out to prove you're as deeply demented as Biden!

Cannonpointer » 27 Oct 2024, 11:48 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 11:48 pm

From whom, jaggov?

Hey stupid!
If a US soldier is believed to have murdered other Americans, (or even found to have murdered the enemy civilians) they would be court-martialed and sent to prison if found guilty!

Have you never heard of the My Lai massacre, moron?

 

jerrab » 27 Oct 2024, 2:41 pm » wrote: ↑

27 Oct 2024, 2:41 pm

the reason it is  a hostile area is because for decades the us has been protecting israel and allowing israel do what it ever wants in gaza or palestine.

So you're of the absurd opinion that if the US stopped supporting Israel, there would no longer be hostilities?
Are you serious?!??
If we stopped supporting them, every country that hates Jews as much as you do would attack and destroy Israel almost immediately!  That may be exactly what you want, but there's no way that you could possibly claim that all hostility between Israel and Gaza would end!
And so we will CONTINUE to help defend Israel against terrorists as well as against those who hate them as much as you do.
 

Zeets2 » 28 Oct 2024, 9:17 am » wrote: ↑

28 Oct 2024, 9:17 am

The "thinnest of margins", huh?
Is that what a dope like you considers it when Hamas won 74 out of 132 seats of government in 2006?
That's actually a victory that works out to be a margin of 56% of the government seats, and you call that "thin"?!?

Wouldn't you call it a landslide victory if Trump wins 56% of the vote next week?
Use your head for a change nitwit, unless you're out to prove you're as deeply demented as Biden!

No, queer. I would not call just over half a landslide.

Hamas received 44% of the vote, ****. That landed those 56% of the seats.

That is less than half - and that's WITH israel funding and secretly supporting them with intel and manipulations, puke. 

You remember israel. Dey dindu nuffin. It's all cuz ray cissum. Ray cissusm. Dey dindu nuffin.
 

Zeets2 » 28 Oct 2024, 9:21 am » wrote: ↑

28 Oct 2024, 9:21 am

Hey stupid!
If a US soldier is believed to have murdered other Americans, (or even found to have murdered the enemy civilians) they would be court-martialed and sent to prison if found guilty!

Have you never heard of the My Lai massacre, moron?

Homo, stop dancing. Who is going to prosecute them for carrying out orders, you insipid ***?
 
DEY DINDU NUFFIN!
RAY CISSUM!
RAY CISSUM!
RAY CISSUM!

Zeets2 » 28 Oct 2024, 9:06 am » wrote: ↑

28 Oct 2024, 9:06 am

I really don't see how any hope is necessary on either side of the debate.
Do you really expect Israeli policy to change based on how much you despise it?
Or could you possibly fathom a scenario where I change my opinion on it and would stop supporting Israel as the wipe out Hamas and Hezbollah terrorists or retaliate against Iran?
So what do either of us require "hope" for?

And if Palestinians don't learn their lesson from having their choice of Hamas' terrorists as their leaders, then yes they will continue to suffer for that decision.  That's fine by me!  If, as you say, they will not want peace now, then what makes you think that Israel will not continue to fight and destroy any further terrorist attempts that a new Gaza government will use against them?  The simple truth is that nothing will change IF the people of Gaza choose a new terrorist government like Hamas to lead them rather than a government that is willing to recognize Israel legitimacy and peacefully co-exist with them.  Some people simply refuse to learn from history to their own detriment.

Do you really think Israel (or me for that matter) care if those like you look at them as a pariah state, when that's exactly what they've faced for the past 80 years?  How is it that you think it will bring about any change now?

Nothing will change until the Palestinian's  have full autonomy and control over their existence ....

Which they haven't had in decades of brutal Likud policies designed to keep them prisoner's in the world's largest open air prison ...

And yes ....Israel cares if it is deemed as a pariah state because it hurts them economically and also hurts their "Victimhood" narrative as well as destroys their credibility and influence with the rest of the world ....
ànd also ours as well ...




 

Cannonpointer » 28 Oct 2024, 9:37 am » wrote: ↑

28 Oct 2024, 9:37 am

Homo, stop dancing. Who is going to prosecute them for carrying out orders, you insipid ***?
 
DEY DINDU NUFFIN!
RAY CISSUM!
RAY CISSUM!
RAY CISSUM!

I regret thinking you were more knowledgeable than that.
Apparently I was very wrong.

So here, stupid.  It's long past time you educate yourself:

My Lai massacreOn March 16, 1968, Calley led around 100 soldiers of Charlie company into the village of My Lai. Although they faced no resistance, they entered the village shooting. They murdered hundreds of civilians consisting mostly of South Vietnamese elderly men, women, children, and infants using automatic weapons, grenades and bayonets. Infants and children were killed with bayonets, and females were raped and shot.In his new defense, Calley claimed he was following the orders of his immediate superior, Captain Ernest Medina.

Calley was instead charged on September 5, 1969, with six specifications of premeditated murder under Article 118 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ)[16] for the deaths of 109 South Vietnamese civilians near the village of Son My, at a hamlet called My Lai. On November 12, 1969, investigative reporters Seymour Hersh[17] and Wayne Greenhaw[18] broke the story and revealed that Calley had been charged with murdering 109 South Vietnamese.[19]

Calley's trial started on November 17, 1970. It was the military prosecution's contention that Calley, in defiance of the rules of engagement, ordered his men to deliberately murder unarmed Vietnamese civilians, even though his men were not under enemy fire at all.

After deliberating for 79 hours, the six-officer jury (five of whom had served in Vietnam) convicted him on March 29, 1971, of the premeditated murder of 22 South Vietnamese civilians. On March 31, 1971, Calley was sentenced to life imprisonment with hard labor at Fort Leavenworth,[32] which includes the United States Disciplinary Barracks, the Department of Defense's only maximum security prison.

Understand it now, dickhead?