Liberal Forum

Congratulations to our first Post of the day winner.
This post wins because it's factual, well written, and accurately cited.

RollingRock » 13 Jun 2020, 3:01 pm » wrote: ↑

13 Jun 2020, 3:01 pm

In three months time?  Do you have a link of reference?  

People's lives are more important than the economy.

If we need to, absolutely.  The trick is getting it right the FIRST time (which we did not do).  

Of course.  And I prioritize American lives first.

I have been unable to find resources on the timeline for US mortality/excess deaths. Wikipedia only shows a chart based on excess mortality from Chile, so we can use that as a proxy (as the outbreak was far deadlier in South America compared to North America).



Excess mortality spike lasted from July 1957 to January 1958 - 6 months time.

The time is actually not as relevant as you think because the total number of deaths follows a logistic, not an exponential, curve. As time progresses, the total # of deaths will sizzle out, unless a "second wave" comes (which it will, whether we lockdown or not - and if anything, I would argue the inability of the lockdown to prevent a "second wave" is actually strong evidence against the lockdown itself).

Unfortunately, as your typical American is very math-impaired, he or she probably googled "exponential function" without truly understanding the 10th grade math behind it, and then posted hysterically all over social media about how "5 billion ppl are going to be infected and 100 million dead!" with silly charts if we didn't do everything the Karens demanded.

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"People's lives are more important than the economy."

This is another point, which I predicted you would make, that has made you an unwitting supporter of Wall Street's agenda, which I hope you will re-evaluate in light of everything that's happened (given that you are clearly a Bernie Sanders supporter, I doubt you are a big fan of Wall Street).

The "economy" is not just Wall St's earning reports (which are largely fabricated anyway with non-GAAP numbers - thank the SEC for standing by and letting Wall St criminals loose), Goldman Sachs/other banks front-running Treasury bonds...it is every transaction that enables ordinary people to make a living.

When you tell people living paycheck to paycheck that they CANNOT go and earn $$$ to support themselves, you are aiding in the working class' destruction. You are also allowing Wall Street to impoverish Main Street small businesses, many of which have already gone bankrupt and will no longer serve as competition to Wall Street economic gangsters.

Now I can already see some objections you will raise, and I will address them now:

1. "We can just give the people money, like UBI/unemployment payments/etc."

True, but that's not going to last forever. Since I am not a "libertarian" or "conservative," I don't object to cash transfers (under certain circumstances when people actually need them), but I will tell you, as anyone who understands basic economics does, that this is supposed to be TEMPORARY. It cannot last forever, unless you want the price of staples to skyrocket 500%.

Sooner or later, people will go back to work when what meager savings or government transfers they have dries up...and...the virus will circulate again.

See why I'm not a fan of "lockdowns?"

2. "It's not the working class' fault that they live paycheck to paycheck. It's the system's fault."

OK, so how is shutting down the economy going to help?

It doesn't matter whether you live in a capitalist or socialist system, someone needs to do the labor, or the goods/services won't exist.

A shortage of goods/services is not going to help the working class - in fact, a shortage means only the RICH can afford to pay for those higher prices.

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 If we need to, absolutely.  The trick is getting it right the FIRST time (which we did not do).

What exactly should we have done differently?

And before you even think about it, please do not scapegoat the "lockdown protestors," as they were a very small minority.

If your plan fails because < 0.1% of the population refuses to comply, your plan was destined to fail anyway, as no plan achieves 100% compliance.

I'm also curious as to whether you think the George Floyd inspired "protests" are responsible for the resurgence in Covid cases, and whether we need to disperse THOSE protestors as they are undoubtedly facilitating the spread of the virus with a vengeance.

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Of course.  And I prioritize American lives first.

I do as well. Unfortunately, the lockdowns have destroyed many lives, so I surely hope the lockdowns will not happen again.

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Jun 22, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 13, 2020 4:03pm
 
Go to nomination on Jun 22, 2020 11:59am

Demonrat Mayor Durkan got more than a Summer of Love. 
Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan really liked BLM when they marched through downtown Seattle, wrecking havoc and burning police cars. She absolutely loved them when they took over a six square block area of her city, calling it a block party and that they would engage in a summer of love. But, when they showed up at her house, she decided that she doesn’t like them nearly so much. Durkan said they scared her family and put her kids in danger. The protesters led by communist city council member,  Kshama Sawant marched to her home after she announced that she would no longer support CHOP after a spate of shootings occurred there. But, I don’t understand why she thought it was fine when it was the “common” people whose families were put in peril but suddenly remembered her indignation when it was her family.

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1 Nomination

Cannonpointer Jun 30, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 30, 2020 5:41pm
Go to nomination on Jul 01, 2020 2:34am

I don't necessarily agree with this post, but it reeks of common sense.
I think/hope we would all agree that we would react the same way if we thought our families were in danger.

righteous » 01 Jul 2020, 2:41 pm » wrote: ↑

01 Jul 2020, 2:41 pm

Demonrat Mayor Durkan got more than a Summer of Love. 
Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan really liked BLM when they marched through downtown Seattle, wrecking havoc and burning police cars. She absolutely loved them when they took over a six square block area of her city, calling it a block party and that they would engage in a summer of love. But, when they showed up at her house, she decided that she doesn’t like them nearly so much. Durkan said they scared her family and put her kids in danger. The protesters led by communist city council member,  Kshama Sawant marched to her home after she announced that she would no longer support CHOP after a spate of shootings occurred there. But, I don’t understand why she thought it was fine when it was the “common” people whose families were put in peril but suddenly remembered her indignation when it was her family.

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1 Nomination

Cannonpointer Jun 30, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 30, 2020 5:41pm
Go to nomination on Jul 01, 2020 2:34am

Although I don't tune into the "news" (if you can call it that) much, I skimmed a headline today about how Trump's niece, Mary, wrote a book documenting Trump's flawed personality traits, family history, and misdeeds.

Unsurprisingly, the low and average IQ crowd will swallow this story up like a toddler would with cotton candy.

I do not care about Trump in general, only acknowledging the fact that his primary purpose of being in office is to enrich himself both in terms of net worth and notoriety. Like a normal person, I have very few thoughts on "Trump" or "Biden" or whichever puppet sits/will sit in the WH.

They are a "gnat on an elephant's ***" in terms of importance (as a certain person on this forum likes to say).


But then some odd idea came into my head - what if Trump's niece planned this out in advance with Trump himself?

The deal is simple:

1) Mary writes a book, likely filled with fictitious events and conversations. Bombastic language and coruscating recollections are to be expected.
2) Mary gets royalties from book sales.
3) Mary and DJT split profits - DJT plays his part and acts "incensed" or "disdainful" in public (on Twitter and television) to fool the average and low IQ crowd (85% of America).

And why not? They both profit from this endeavor, and as long as Mary and her other family members keep their mouths shut, nobody will know.

Kind of like how nobody except Fox Insiders knew O'Reilly and Hannity actually hated each other (back when O'Reilly still had his show on FN, they saw each other as competitors and hated each other for "stealing each other's viewers").

And that brings me to theory numero deux...
 

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Jul 05, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 02, 2020 4:43pm
Go to nomination on Jul 05, 2020 4:35pm

KFSW » 24 Jun 2020, 5:47 pm » wrote: ↑

24 Jun 2020, 5:47 pm

Murica is baby country that became to big for its lil britches.
A very immature country.  Just look at the presidential candidates.  
These narcissistic loons are symptomatic of a sick country.
Putin ran circles around Obama and know Trump.  Biden?? LMAO.  Putin will *** rape Biden like a drunk Blasey-Ford.
The world continues to trust Russia and China more than WAR, INC *** USA.  

Get yer popcorn and watch it unfold

That is a somewhat crude and hateful assessment, but not wrong I guess.  If you are into accelerationism these are Heady times to live in.  Me, I just hunker in my bunker and think about death a lot.  I never used to contemplate my own death before 2020, now I think about it every day.  What’s going to get me?  Covid?  A violent mob?  A cop that I look at sideways on a bad day?  The giant tidal wave of homelessness that is surely about to flood the streets as all the eviction protection runs out?

I was born in 1974, and I heard tell about scary times in the US from the 1960s, with the Cuban missile crisis and the regular racial rioting and civil unrest in US cities.  I heard it was downright terrifying at times.  I never could relate, because I led a charmed life, the son of a business owner in Michigan, with a fair to middling middle class upbringing.  I never had a day of existential fear for the fate of this whole country.  Never has it felt like a social experiment that could go sideways like Nazi Germany or a Bolshevik revolution.  Until this year, that is.
 

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Jun 25, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 24, 2020 11:09pm
Go to nomination on Jun 25, 2020 10:40am

A classic liberal?
What's that? Probably means I'm not.

A classical liberal?
What l/Libertarians call themselves? Nope. I'll pass on the Ayn Rand deification and the property is more important than people nonsense.

A real liberal? A true liberal? An actual liberal?
Is that like a real, true, actual Scotsman? I'm probably not. My ancestors were Welsh, French, British, German, Russian, etc and most of Eastern Europe (Jewish, though I'm not Jewish). No Scots. Basically they traveled a bit had a lot of sex. Horny bastards.

I have a mix of liberal, progressive and some conservative ideas & beliefs. Folks here probably consider me far, far, far to the left. Because most cannot think their way out of a wet paper bag. Clem, for instance.

All 4 of the repugnant positions presented have a similar mix of issues which get complex pretty quickly. Free speech vs consent vs criminality vs control. Individual to individual to society to state.

Maybe I'm mistaken, but I believe you wanted the free speech discussion on those 4 issues. Since you did not set limits, I won't indulge you on that speculation. I'm not going to write a book. I'll give each one more than one sentence.

Let's have a guiding principle: Nelson Mandela — 'A Nation should not be judged by how it treats its highest citizens, but it's lowest ones'. Not a totally original thought. You can find similar voiced by others throughout history.

1. NAMBLA?
They get to say what they say and decent people get to say why they are freaks poisonous to society and dangerous to children. Free speech for both sides. That they put a target on their own backs so law enforcement can keep an eye on them is great, IMO.

The right to say vile things exists. That right is not absolute and does not obligate me to offer them a stage or microphone or my attention or my debate. It also does not extend to actions. It's when they move from words to actions that they need to be caught, tried, convicted and jailed.

I am against the way the death penalty has been misused in this country. "Beyond a reasonable doubt" has been shown to fail too often. I would argue someone who has been convicted of molesting or raping a child "beyond any doubt" should be taken out behind the chemical shed to get a bullet in their head, to steal imagery from V for Vendetta.

They have given up their right to exist with the rest of us. They don't get to destroy children's lives.

2. The wearing of Burkas?
If someone wants to wear a Burka wear one. If someone does not want to wear a Burka, don't wear one.

Problems occur because you have two small groups within larger groups, Muslim and Muslim-hating, that both use the issue as an attempt of control by codifying laws for and against.

There are extreme Muslims who want to make it more than a religious obligation for all Muslim women. Many want all women, Muslim or not, to wear Burka's whether they want to or not. I don't agree they get to make the call for any women. Not their body. They don't like it and in cases they have killed women who argue against them or refuse to wear one.

There are extreme Muslim-haters that wish to deny agency to any women who would choose to wear a Burka and prevent her from doing so for many imaginative reasons. It's a three-fer. They get to **** on Muslim's and **** on women while gas-lighting they are champions of women.

Both group of ****-wits need to be placed in a large room, armed with knives and then the doors get welded shut. Everyone else walks away.

3. Prayer instead of medical attention for your child?
You get to be as anti-vax, pray the disease away as you want. Up until the point you are harming your child. Children are not property. They are a responsibility.

Once, again, speech vs action. Once your actions harm, you are up on charges. Rightfully so. With any luck the state will catch you beforehand and get the kid healthcare. That happens. Not often enough.

You get to have your religion & religious speech. You don't get to kill your kids in the practice of your religion.

There is a recent story where parents killed their kid by exposing her to Covid-19 at church even though she was immuno-suppressed. She died days after her 17th birthday. The parents were healthcare workers. Their political speech in favor of Trump led them to kill their own child through negligence.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/flo ... 47609.html
https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medica ... r-BB16ssMt
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/el ... urch-event
https://www.wftv.com/news/trending/teen ... OHOCII3AQ/

4. Virtual kiddy porn?
There are different ideas on this subject in different parts of the world. USA vs Japan has a huge abyss of difference of opinion. You won't find many American men reading Teen Rape Comic books on the subway on the way to and from work.

IANAL.

You can probably make all the cartoons porn you want. Once you move beyond cartoons, your mileage can take you to prison.

Based on the news I've read about the US, if you create a comic based on an actual child, that is considered kiddie porn and you go to jail. This is slightly different from the first example, but no less disgusting IMO.

Your freedom of speech does not mean you get to make computer generated pornography depicting someone else's real child having sex with adults even if it is in the form of a cartoon. In writing this I realize the deep fake technology exists right now which probably makes it possible to make quite disgusting porn like this, and probably already has been done. So much more than very disturbing.

You get caught doing this crap, go to jail, do not pass GO, do not collect $200. Seems fair to me. If you took it out of the virtual world into the real world, trip behind the chemical shed for you.

Your "right" to speech that turns you on does not extend to images of my or anyone else's kid.

That's it.

One persons rights vs another persons vs society as a whole vs the state. You'd think this would be simpler. Well, maybe not you or me, but Clem would.
 
 

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Jul 08, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 08, 2020 4:38pm
Go to nomination on Jul 08, 2020 6:23pm

A classic liberal?
What's that? Probably means I'm not.

A classical liberal?
What l/Libertarians call themselves? Nope. I'll pass on the Ayn Rand deification and the property is more important than people nonsense.

A real liberal? A true liberal? An actual liberal?
Is that like a real, true, actual Scotsman? I'm probably not. My ancestors were Welsh, French, British, German, Russian, etc and most of Eastern Europe (Jewish, though I'm not Jewish). No Scots. Basically they traveled a bit had a lot of sex. Horny bastards.

I have a mix of liberal, progressive and some conservative ideas & beliefs. Folks here probably consider me far, far, far to the left. Because most cannot think their way out of a wet paper bag. Clem, for instance.

All 4 of the repugnant positions presented have a similar mix of issues which get complex pretty quickly. Free speech vs consent vs criminality vs control. Individual to individual to society to state.

Maybe I'm mistaken, but I believe you wanted the free speech discussion on those 4 issues. Since you did not set limits, I won't indulge you on that speculation. I'm not going to write a book. I'll give each one more than one sentence.

Let's have a guiding principle: Nelson Mandela — 'A Nation should not be judged by how it treats its highest citizens, but it's lowest ones'. Not a totally original thought. You can find similar voiced by others throughout history.

1. NAMBLA?
They get to say what they say and decent people get to say why they are freaks poisonous to society and dangerous to children. Free speech for both sides. That they put a target on their own backs so law enforcement can keep an eye on them is great, IMO.

The right to say vile things exists. That right is not absolute and does not obligate me to offer them a stage or microphone or my attention or my debate. It also does not extend to actions. It's when they move from words to actions that they need to be caught, tried, convicted and jailed.

I am against the way the death penalty has been misused in this country. "Beyond a reasonable doubt" has been shown to fail too often. I would argue someone who has been convicted of molesting or raping a child "beyond any doubt" should be taken out behind the chemical shed to get a bullet in their head, to steal imagery from V for Vendetta.

They have given up their right to exist with the rest of us. They don't get to destroy children's lives.

2. The wearing of Burkas?
If someone wants to wear a Burka wear one. If someone does not want to wear a Burka, don't wear one.

Problems occur because you have two small groups within larger groups, Muslim and Muslim-hating, that both use the issue as an attempt of control by codifying laws for and against.

There are extreme Muslims who want to make it more than a religious obligation for all Muslim women. Many want all women, Muslim or not, to wear Burka's whether they want to or not. I don't agree they get to make the call for any women. Not their body. They don't like it and in cases they have killed women who argue against them or refuse to wear one.

There are extreme Muslim-haters that wish to deny agency to any women who would choose to wear a Burka and prevent her from doing so for many imaginative reasons. It's a three-fer. They get to **** on Muslim's and **** on women while gas-lighting they are champions of women.

Both group of ****-wits need to be placed in a large room, armed with knives and then the doors get welded shut. Everyone else walks away.

3. Prayer instead of medical attention for your child?
You get to be as anti-vax, pray the disease away as you want. Up until the point you are harming your child. Children are not property. They are a responsibility.

Once, again, speech vs action. Once your actions harm, you are up on charges. Rightfully so. With any luck the state will catch you beforehand and get the kid healthcare. That happens. Not often enough.

You get to have your religion & religious speech. You don't get to kill your kids in the practice of your religion.

There is a recent story where parents killed their kid by exposing her to Covid-19 at church even though she was immuno-suppressed. She died days after her 17th birthday. The parents were healthcare workers. Their political speech in favor of Trump led them to kill their own child through negligence.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/flo ... 47609.html
https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medica ... r-BB16ssMt
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/el ... urch-event
https://www.wftv.com/news/trending/teen ... OHOCII3AQ/

4. Virtual kiddy porn?
There are different ideas on this subject in different parts of the world. USA vs Japan has a huge abyss of difference of opinion. You won't find many American men reading Teen Rape Comic books on the subway on the way to and from work.

IANAL.

You can probably make all the cartoons porn you want. Once you move beyond cartoons, your mileage can take you to prison.

Based on the news I've read about the US, if you create a comic based on an actual child, that is considered kiddie porn and you go to jail. This is slightly different from the first example, but no less disgusting IMO.

Your freedom of speech does not mean you get to make computer generated pornography depicting someone else's real child having sex with adults even if it is in the form of a cartoon. In writing this I realize the deep fake technology exists right now which probably makes it possible to make quite disgusting porn like this, and probably already has been done. So much more than very disturbing.

You get caught doing this crap, go to jail, do not pass GO, do not collect $200. Seems fair to me. If you took it out of the virtual world into the real world, trip behind the chemical shed for you.

Your "right" to speech that turns you on does not extend to images of my or anyone else's kid.

That's it.

One persons rights vs another persons vs society as a whole vs the state. You'd think this would be simpler. Well, maybe not you or me, but Clem would.
 
 

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Jul 08, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 08, 2020 4:38pm
Go to nomination on Jul 08, 2020 6:23pm

Today’s winner is a bit of an outlier. I generally want only the best of the best of original content. But today the OP made a real point of reading and digesting and defending the copy-paste article.

This is just another attempt by THE PIG to deflect from his failures. It's a campaign stunt to escalate an already heated protest. In effect he has skirted the Posse Comitatus Act by not using military troops, but instead using the justice dept. goons. This wasn't a plan thought up by THE PIG, he's not smart enough. This was Barr's and THE PIG's campaign minions. If the American people can't see through this ruse, I really don't think there is much hope for our republic unless we vote this bastard out along with all his people. You have the power. Vote like our democracy depends on it. We fought a war, and many people died to end the rule of a king. I'm not asking you to die. Please vote.

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1 Nomination

Misty Jul 17, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 17, 2020 10:31pm
Go to nomination on Jul 17, 2020 9:38pm

RollingRock » 16 Jun 2020, 12:56 pm » wrote: ↑

16 Jun 2020, 12:56 pm

What if we sent mental health exerts instead of the police?   

Seems to me this is a "no brainer."  Imo, people with pronounced psychiatric issues should always be addressed by those trained in mental health issues.  Thoughts?

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019 ... and-sweden

Agree RR. In many Northern European jurisdictions, police officers spend years learning the complexities of dealing with mental illness. Their core objective is to de-escalate and protect people from harm until appropriately trained professionals can respond. 

Sometimes it seems as if cops here are trained to do exactly the opposite. Too often they escalate violence unnecessarily. We’ve seen far too many instances of it lately. Everything from the killing of George Floyd to the coordinated assaults on peaceful protestors. 

Time to study Camden, NJ and Europe. Find out what works and what doesn’t work.  Replace the tough guy/military mentality with a community service mentality. 
 
 

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1 Nomination

bludog Jun 18, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 16, 2020 3:55pm
Go to nomination on Jun 19, 2020 2:31pm

progressivecitizen » 03 Jul 2020, 9:32 pm » wrote: ↑

03 Jul 2020, 9:32 pm

Most of their boards disappeared and now I am getting a browser message telling me there's a risk in entering. Was it taken over by trolls? But this seems to be the same site in a way.

Why do you care? Why do you miss it? It's become a neo nazi forum ever since a white supremist racist took it over. If you're not one of those people you have no business being on that site at all. I'm sure the FBI and others monitor it daily. 

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1 Nomination

Older Guy Jul 24, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 03, 2020 7:59pm
Go to nomination on Jul 25, 2020 6:47pm

AnnoyedLiberall » 29 Jul 2020, 9:22 am » wrote: ↑

29 Jul 2020, 9:22 am

That's the truth they don't want to hear.

As I am watching most of the protests from afar thru what the MSM wants me to see color me crazy but it seems there are more white's protesting and rioting than any other race or ethnic group.  Yes, there are blacks as well but it seems the issues in places like Seattle and Portland are mostly young whites run amok.  The are plenty of peaceful protesters of many races.  Whatever movement they are representing has been hijacked by others with a different agenda.

I know we have discussed this before but immediately following Floyd that there was a helluva lot of unity in this country.  Right and left, black and white, cops and non cops agreed what happened was despicable.  But, those with other agendas moved in and we are where we are at now.  

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Jul 29, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 29, 2020 10:15am
Go to nomination on Jul 29, 2020 10:27am

RollingRock » 16 Jun 2020, 12:56 pm » wrote: ↑

16 Jun 2020, 12:56 pm

What if we sent mental health exerts instead of the police?   

Seems to me this is a "no brainer."  Imo, people with pronounced psychiatric issues should always be addressed by those trained in mental health issues.  Thoughts?

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019 ... and-sweden

Agree RR. In many Northern European jurisdictions, police officers spend years learning the complexities of dealing with mental illness. Their core objective is to de-escalate and protect people from harm until appropriately trained professionals can respond. 

Sometimes it seems as if cops here are trained to do exactly the opposite. Too often they escalate violence unnecessarily. We’ve seen far too many instances of it lately. Everything from the killing of George Floyd to the coordinated assaults on peaceful protestors. 

Time to study Camden, NJ and Europe. Find out what works and what doesn’t work.  Replace the tough guy/military mentality with a community service mentality. 
 
 

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1 Nomination

bludog Jun 18, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 16, 2020 3:55pm
Go to nomination on Jun 19, 2020 2:31pm

KFSW » 31 Jul 2020, 1:27 pm » wrote: ↑

31 Jul 2020, 1:27 pm

It will be The Golden Calf

I don't know how old you are (I'm assuming 45-50), but I was an avid Internet user back in the mid 90's. AOL, Kazaa, and all that **** Boomers can only dream of using back when you needed to not be a complete tech-retard. (My apologies if you are a Boomer, but you get my implied message)

I distinctly remember how decentralized the Internet was back then. I had 10-15 sites I would visit and content was completely uncensored.

Thanks to all this consolidation (inevitable under capitalism if you read Karl Marx - I'm not a Marxist, but I do agree with his tenet that centralization of "market players" is inevitable unless the gubmint steps up to the plate), we are now exposed to the same garbage opinions rehashed over and over by the (((MAINSTREAM MEDIA))) and its online counterparts.

LiberalForum.net is one of the few diamonds left in the rough - a dinosaur in the post-Cretaceous era. The sad part is how many stupid people voice their opinions here, but alas, it is still preferable to the alternative - bunch of Karens and soy boys screaming on social media about how "millions of Americans are going to die if we don't throw 15 million people out of work!"

That's why I NEVER use Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and other platforms catering to low IQ morons. Even LinkedIn is becoming intolerable with those "inspirational stories" about how some CEO gets up at 5 AM, runs a half-marathon, and finishes his morning routine within 2 hours every day, and that everyone who doesn't do the same is a failure.  

Sorry I needed to get that off my chest, you may resume your regularly scheduled program now.
 
 

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1 Nomination

KFSW Jul 31, 2020

Go to original post on Jul 31, 2020 3:28pm
Go to nomination on Jul 31, 2020 3:30pm

“Efforts to reject the mainstream merely result in a new conformity.” -MIT Technology Review

https://www.technologyreview.com/2019/0 ... -the-same/

The hipster effect: those who want to make anti-conformist statements end up looking almost identical to others who wish to make similar statements. I.e. the guy in skinny jeans and a tie dye shirt with blue hair who is vegan and loves the planet although he has yet to spend one solid day in the wilderness.

Although “tight-fitting jeans can cause urinary tract infections, twisted testicles, bladder weakness and long-term health consequences,” they continue to be a trend among ‘men’ who claim to belong to the counterculture. Not a counterculture I want to be a part of.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.medica ... les/247826

We have evolved through natural selection to work in groups to survive. ‘Herd mentality,’ which is mocked today by all ends of the political spectrum, is subconsciously adopted by many on a daily basis, even when one believes he is rebelling against the norm.

The rise of social media has heightened this effect. When did you last make a decision that wasn’t influenced by a government, corporation, public figure, or something someone else was doing? If you defy a government, you are likely to join a group of individuals who think similarly. If you boycott a corporation, you are likely to take similar actions to others in circumventing it. If you hate a public figure, that sentiment likely came from something another person said.

Humans have a desire to feel special and unique, to feel that they offer something to the world that others can’t or don’t. But to what extent are you willing to go to prove your point, and will it end up harming you in the long run?

Let us put to rest the tired argument that one should or should not take an action because other people are or are not doing it. In the end, you are not special, and there are likely to be similar people who are taking an action for reasons similar to yours. Instead, judge it solely on the consequences it will have for your life and the life of those you will impact.
 
 

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Aug 05, 2020

Go to original post on Aug 05, 2020 12:50am
Go to nomination on Aug 05, 2020 10:12am

promoderate » 06 Aug 2020, 6:52 am » wrote: ↑

06 Aug 2020, 6:52 am

“Efforts to reject the mainstream merely result in a new conformity.” -MIT Technology Review

https://www.technologyreview.com/2019/0 ... -the-same/

The hipster effect: those who want to make anti-conformist statements end up looking almost identical to others who wish to make similar statements. I.e. the guy in skinny jeans and a tie dye shirt with blue hair who is vegan and loves the planet although he has yet to spend one solid day in the wilderness.

Although “tight-fitting jeans can cause urinary tract infections, twisted testicles, bladder weakness and long-term health consequences,” they continue to be a trend among ‘men’ who claim to belong to the counterculture. Not a counterculture I want to be a part of.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.medica ... les/247826

We have evolved through natural selection to work in groups to survive. ‘Herd mentality,’ which is mocked today by all ends of the political spectrum, is subconsciously adopted by many on a daily basis, even when one believes he is rebelling against the norm.

The rise of social media has heightened this effect. When did you last make a decision that wasn’t influenced by a government, corporation, public figure, or something someone else was doing? If you defy a government, you are likely to join a group of individuals who think similarly. If you boycott a corporation, you are likely to take similar actions to others in circumventing it. If you hate a public figure, that sentiment likely came from something another person said.

Humans have a desire to feel special and unique, to feel that they offer something to the world that others can’t or don’t. But to what extent are you willing to go to prove your point, and will it end up harming you in the long run?

Let us put to rest the tired argument that one should or should not take an action because other people are or are not doing it. In the end, you are not special, and there are likely to be similar people who are taking an action for reasons similar to yours. Instead, judge it solely on the consequences it will have for your life and the life of those you will impact.
 
 

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1 Nomination

Annoyed Liberall Aug 05, 2020

Go to original post on Aug 05, 2020 12:50am
Go to nomination on Aug 05, 2020 10:12am

You had me at twisted testicles.

RollingRock » 16 Jun 2020, 12:56 pm » wrote: ↑

16 Jun 2020, 12:56 pm

What if we sent mental health exerts instead of the police?   

Seems to me this is a "no brainer."  Imo, people with pronounced psychiatric issues should always be addressed by those trained in mental health issues.  Thoughts?

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019 ... and-sweden

Agree RR. In many Northern European jurisdictions, police officers spend years learning the complexities of dealing with mental illness. Their core objective is to de-escalate and protect people from harm until appropriately trained professionals can respond. 

Sometimes it seems as if cops here are trained to do exactly the opposite. Too often they escalate violence unnecessarily. We’ve seen far too many instances of it lately. Everything from the killing of George Floyd to the coordinated assaults on peaceful protestors. 

Time to study Camden, NJ and Europe. Find out what works and what doesn’t work.  Replace the tough guy/military mentality with a community service mentality. 
 
 

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1 Nomination

bludog Jun 18, 2020

Go to original post on Jun 16, 2020 3:55pm
Go to nomination on Jun 19, 2020 2:31pm

Olivaw » 16 Aug 2020, 6:52 pm » wrote: ↑

16 Aug 2020, 6:52 pm

Rock » 16 Aug 2020, 5:06 pm » wrote: ↑

16 Aug 2020, 5:06 pm

I have a question for you.You seem like a reasonable person. Misguided but reasonable. Let's say that massive mail in voting is permitted in Nov. Not just absentee ballots which come with way more safeguards. But everyone who is registered to vote is mailed a ballot and then makes their selection and mails it back in. I don't know if you read some of my earlier posts but I am a retired letter carrier for the USPS and I can tell you unequivocally that many (not just a few) but many ballots will not be counted for reasons that I have posted earlier. 

So let's say the loser of the election, doesn't matter who, Biden or Trump, hears that possibly thousands, hundreds of thousands, millions of votes never reached their destination. Either through undelivered mail, people stealing ballots, or postal workers not delivering ballots in a timely manner (believe me it happens). What happens next? Lawsuits. Courts involved. Supreme Court. It will be Florida hanging chads x 1000. 

Mark my words.

There are always errors in elections. It happens with in person voting and it will happen with mail in ballots. It seldom matter unless the margin of victory is < 0.02%.  Are you confident that safeguards cannot be implemented to maintain that normal margin of error? 

Envelopes will be preprinted and routed by machines. The process needs to be supervised by trustworthy individuals. Ballots need to be turned over to poll workers in bulk, Not treated like regular letters. 

One alternative, I suppose, is to allow people to drop their ballot in a secured slot and leave USPS out of it. Unfortunately, I don’t think there’s time to build out the infrastructure.

Rock's experiences working in the USPS seem a lot different than mine.
He was a letter carrier in Kentucky and I worked in the three largest Post Offices/Mail processing facilities in Manhattan.

He probably delivered mail to individual private residences.
I worked in mail processing, in one facility that had 5,000 Postal employees.

These  mail in ballots are not likely to be delivered to elections offices by any one letter carrier. 
They will go through a bar code machine and be placed in trays in bulk.
Most likely the county elections offices will pick them up at the P.O. themselves like the big banks on Wall Street do.

When any one entity gets this much mail, it does not get delivered by a letter carrier.
The entity usually has to come to the Post Office to pick up their mail.
I worked at the call window in the PO across the street from the TwinTowers, where the big banks and brokerage houses would come and pick up their mail.


 Rock doesn't seem to have much faith in Postal Workers.
I have a lot of faith that Postal Workers are up to the job.
 
 

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1 Nomination

Olivaw Aug 16, 2020

Go to original post on Aug 16, 2020 8:28pm
Go to nomination on Aug 17, 2020 11:44am

Olivaw » 17 Aug 2020, 6:27 pm » wrote: ↑

17 Aug 2020, 6:27 pm

I’m a fairly moderate / center-lefty so I’m comfortable with the list of speakers. Progressives may be disappointed.

Beau of the Fifth Column is a progressive. He has something to say about the “not so liberal” Democratic Convention lineup. As usual, he is thoughtful and articulate,

Thanks for the insightful video.

Because of universal Democratic agreement of the necessity of ousting Trump, Democrats are already united.  And those on the Far Left are just as determined as moderates, to replace Trump with Biden, so the their votes can be taken for granted.

That's why I think Beau is on target about the DNC strategy being to attract disaffected Trump voters.  But since Bernie Sanders will be one of the speakers tonight, I cannot fully accept the contention that the DNC has entirely abandoned the Left Wing of the Democratic Party. 

Neither am I convinced that a Biden administration will be as Conservative as Beau forecasts.  For instance, Biden has frequently expressed support for an energized, new labor union movement with the aim of increasing unionization, Nationwide.   If he comes through on that promise alone, he will have accomplished a lot.  Of course much of Biden's ability to affect real change will hinge on whether we can flip the Senate or not.
 
 
 

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1 Nomination

Olivaw Aug 17, 2020

Go to original post on Aug 17, 2020 6:44pm
Go to nomination on Aug 18, 2020 6:39pm