Liberal Forum

Zeets2 » 11 Oct 2022, 9:26 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:26 am

Care to name an economic system that you think is better?
 

Dare explain what went wrong instead of playing speculation over and over again.

omh » 11 Oct 2022, 9:28 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:28 am

Dare explain what went wrong instead of playing speculation over and over again.

It's very simple to know what went wrong.

Liberalism.
 

Zeets2 » 11 Oct 2022, 9:33 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:33 am

It's very simple to know what went wrong.

Liberalism.

Liberism is nothing but the logic of capitalism expanded to society as a whole

fair competition between individuals results in meritocracy
 

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 9:42 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:42 am

Liberism is nothing but the logic of capitalism expanded to society as a whole

fair competition between individuals results in meritocracy

Where did you come up with THAT explanation?
Liberalism is the direct polar opposite of capitalism.

And it always has been!

Zeets2 » 11 Oct 2022, 9:49 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:49 am

Where did you come up with THAT explanation?
Liberalism is the direct polar opposite of capitalism.

And it always has been!

uh...capitalism is a direct consequence of liberalism. Adam smith...remember? I don't understand you.

Zeets2 » 11 Oct 2022, 9:33 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:33 am

It's very simple to know what went wrong.

Liberalism.
 

You are inaccurate because you are avoiding something naturally taking place equally for everything existing in plain sight. You picked a topic of intellectual social consensus identity to blame, not why one thing corrupted every reality does practicing the same social behavior within one species with many separate types of ancestral progression taking place in series parallel evolving specifically as biologically present.

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 9:50 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:50 am

uh...capitalism is a direct consequence of liberalism. Adam smith...remember? I don't understand you.

...you are talking about the subjective theory of 'classical liberali$m'... the other republicrat-level monetary ignoramus is talking about 'liberali$m' as defined today by puppet$ limbaugh, beck, hannity, carlson, etc. puppet trump/republican cacksuckers [and monetary ignoramuses]         

...stfu about 'isms' until you understand the money, dummies...

"The state does not function as we desired. The car does not obey. A man is at the wheel and he seems to lead it, but the car does not drive in the desired direction. It moves as another force wishes.“  
(gee willikers beaver, why is that?)       

 
 

peepee » 11 Oct 2022, 10:13 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:13 am

...you are talking about the subjective theory of 'classical liberali$m'... the other republicrat-level monetary ignoramus is talking about 'liberali$m' as defined today by puppet$ limbaugh, beck, hannity, carlson, etc. puppet trump/republican cacksuckers [and monetary ignoramuses]         

...stfu about 'isms' until you understand the money, dummies...

"The state does not function as we desired. The car does not obey. A man is at the wheel and he seems to lead it, but the car does not drive in the desired direction. It moves as another force wishes.“  
(gee willikers beaver, why is that?)       

 
 

What is your objective always avoiding the natural solution to people cannot life forever in current form occupying space delivered one at a time so far.

peepee » 11 Oct 2022, 10:13 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:13 am

...you are talking about the subjective theory of 'classical liberali$m'... the other republicrat-level monetary ignoramus is talking about 'liberali$m' as defined today by puppet$ limbaugh, beck, hannity, carlson, etc. puppet trump/republican cacksuckers [and monetary ignoramuses]         

...stfu about 'isms' until you understand the money, dummies...

"The state does not function as we desired. The car does not obey. A man is at the wheel and he seems to lead it, but the car does not drive in the desired direction. It moves as another force wishes.“  
(gee willikers beaver, why is that?)     

The gop and democratic party both follow the political and ethical assumptions of liberalism. There actually is no difference between them.

having control over the money supply of a country gives you power. You cannot change that. Just deal with it and stop complaining. 

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 10:20 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:20 am

The gop and democratic party both follow the political and ethical assumptions of liberalism. There actually is no difference between them.

having control over the money supply of a country gives you power. You cannot change that. Just deal with it and stop complaining. 

when will people believing incomplete interpretations can define everything limited to mutually evolving in series parallel biological placement now as specifically ancestrally here any rotation of the plane accurately accounting for total sum past and current events changing forward as individually reaching a new total sum constantly unique to each collectively as a whole truth not justified in theories and theologies misleading ancestries into tomorrow already present.

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 10:20 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:20 am

The gop and democratic party both follow the political and ethical assumptions of liberalism.

....all concerned are authoritardian monetary ignoramuses like you... you voted for the republicrat puppet trump and i suspect you will again...although you won't admit it... 

...do yourself a favor and stfu about your stinking theories/observations about money.... you are an obvious ignoramus as to monetary reality...your retarded priorities are f@cked.... wordle..     

...who creates our money?... how do they do it?.... who gets it first?.... why does money have 'value', FUNDAMENTALLY? 

...deal with that or stfu, dud! ..   
 

peepee » 11 Oct 2022, 10:29 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:29 am

....all concerned are authoritardian monetary ignoramuses like you... you voted for the republicrat puppet trump and i suspect you will again...although you won't admit it... 

...do yourself a favor and stfu about your stinking theories/observations about money.... you are an obvious ignoramus as to monetary reality...your retarded priorities are f@cked.... wordle..  :rofl:   :wave:  

 

fools honor the tradition of keeping the fooled compromising with never accepting life in real time displaced as occupying space here now.

peepee » 11 Oct 2022, 10:29 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:29 am

....all concerned are authoritardian monetary ignoramuses like you... you voted for the republicrat puppet trump and i suspect you will again...although you won't admit it... 

...do yourself a favor and stfu about your stinking theories/observations about money.... you are an obvious ignoramus as to monetary reality...your retarded priorities are f@cked.... wordle..     

...who creates our money?... how do they do it?.... who gets it first?.... why does money have 'value', FUNDAMENTALLY? 

...deal with that or stfu, dud! .. 

you are being retarded. I am not a closet trump supporter. Are you?

peepee » 11 Oct 2022, 10:29 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:29 am

....all concerned are authoritardian monetary ignoramuses like you... you voted for the republicrat puppet trump and i suspect you will again...although you won't admit it... 

...do yourself a favor and stfu about your stinking theories/observations about money.... you are an obvious ignoramus as to monetary reality...your retarded priorities are f@cked.... wordle..     

...who creates our money?... how do they do it?.... who gets it first?.... why does money have 'value', FUNDAMENTALLY? 

...deal with that or stfu, dud! .. 

And your obsession with the fed and its procedures is just stupid and irrelevant. None of that matters. 

Return to basics. People will have power. It will always be thus. You can never win a war against basic reality. 

What I shoukd strive for is for power to be on my side. I care nothing about the details of how power operates as long as it is on my side. 
 

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 10:44 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 10:44 am

Return to basics. People will have power. It will always be thus. 

...i want to empower individuals, you want to empower some unspecified monstrous authoritardians [and monetary ignoramuses]

...i want any 'power'/government exercised wisely, transparently, in an egalitarian manner, 'justly' etc... you want some hitlertarded nazi scumbags [and monetary ignoramuses] ruling in an arbitrary fashion with an iron fist...where nobody can even criticize you/your f@cking fools... wordle...         

peepee » 11 Oct 2022, 11:26 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 11:26 am

...i want to empower individuals, you want to empower some unspecified monstrous authoritardians [and monetary ignoramuses]

...i want any 'power'/government exercised wisely, transparently, in an egalitarian manner, 'justly' etc... you want some hitlertarded nazi scumbags [and monetary ignoramuses] ruling in an arbitrary fashion with an iron fist...where nobody can even criticize you/your f@cking fools... wordle...   

You can want to empower 'individuals' all you like. But it's stupid. You can't. Individuals have never been empowered and never will be.

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 9:50 am » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 9:50 am

uh...capitalism is a direct consequence of liberalism. Adam smith...remember? I don't understand you.

I've read Wealth of Nations and don't recall seeing that sentiment.  Smith was a strong proponent of laissez-faire regarding government and recognized how 
government is always the most wasteful squanderers of money and how it always will be, due to the simple fact that they spend other people's money.  And that when government is restrained from doing so, it provides the most efficient results for everyone; the rich who profit, the poor who obtain employment as a result, and the community which progresses through their combined endeavors.

The fact that you believe that both the Republican and Democrat parties both follow the assumptions of liberalism equally exposes the fallacy of your argument.  Although it's true that the Republican party has culled far too much of the liberal dogma (in my opinion) expressed constantly by Democrats, the difference is stark and cannot be equated.  Accepting (let's say) 25% of what liberals demand that government control certain authoritative policies (social security, welfare, food stamps, etc.) DOES NOT make them the equivalent of the remaining demands of liberals, such as high confiscatory taxation, codifying "hate speech", or mandates on what business MUST provide to both their employees and to the surrounding communities.

Smith had the misfortune to live prior to the emergence of the US as singularly the most wealthy, strongest, and most equitable country in the world, and he therefore had no successful model to compare it with.  

Zeets2 » 11 Oct 2022, 12:03 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 12:03 pm

The fact that you believe that both the Republican and Democrat parties both follow the assumptions of liberalism equally exposes the fallacy of your argument.  Although it's true that the Republican party has culled far too much of the liberal dogma (in my opinion) expressed constantly by Democrats, the difference is stark and cannot be equated.  Accepting (let's say) 25% of what liberals demand that government control certain authoritative policies (social security, welfare, food stamps, etc.) DOES NOT make them the equivalent of the remaining demands of liberals, such as high confiscatory taxation, codifying "hate speech", or mandates on what business MUST provide to both their employees and to the surrounding communities.

Smith had the misfortune to live prior to the emergence of the US as singularly the most wealthy, strongest, and most equitable country in the world, and he therefore had no successful model to compare it with.

you yourself follow all the basic assumptions of liberalism. You would have to escape the false dichotomy you currently live in to see it. 

are you an anarchist? No. Your goal is fair competition between individuals, and thr state exists merely to ensure the competition is fair. 

The 'democrats', who you believe yourself to oppose, simply do not think the competition is sufficiently fair. 

I personally exist outside both of your paradigms. I am a fascist. I do not want competition between individuals. I want collaboration. 
 

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 12:14 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 12:14 pm

you yourself follow all the basic assumptions of liberalism. You would have to escape the false dichotomy you currently live in to see it. 

are you an anarchist? No. Your goal is fair competition between individuals, and thr state exists merely to ensure the competition is fair. 

The 'democrats', who you believe yourself to oppose, simply do not think the competition is sufficiently fair. 

I personally exist outside both of your paradigms. I am a fascist. I do not want competition between individuals. I want collaboration. 
 

you follow all intellectual rules established to save humanity regardless the cost to ancestral progression left evolving remaining ever changing population forward here.

FOS » 11 Oct 2022, 12:14 pm » wrote: ↑

11 Oct 2022, 12:14 pm

you yourself follow all the basic assumptions of liberalism.

I reject the premise that I "follow all the basic assumptions of liberalism", as I strongly oppose the vast majority of liberal beliefs.  What I'm (reluctantly) willing to accept are the most simplistic policies that were forced upon us by government decades ago, but have since metastasized now into an enormous burden on entrepreneurs (and the entire country) that seemingly grow more grotesque with every Democrat leadership since then; increasingly higher taxes, overbearing regulations, unrealistic mandates, minimum wage requirements, an unfair system of justice, prolific government spending, and so much more.

The poor will ALWAYS believe that the rich are unfairly compensated in the wealth they've achieved, and need to be reigned in no matter how much damage to the economy that results in. Such a belief is rooted in envy, jealousy, and hatred, most often coming from those who have no interest in actually doing the hard work involved with those taking the monetary risks that others are willing to do.  And when liberal government leaders agree with them and promise a swift and harsh correction to that status quo in order to secure their votes, such a remedy ALWAYS fails to provide what has been promised.  I've watched whole industries destroyed by that governmentally-imposed damage, with never a backwards glance by those in authority to consider how or why the attempt failed. 

You cannot make the poor wealthy by stealing from the rich, nor can a government tax it's way into prosperity.  Liberalism is the catalyst that attempts to prove otherwise, and has NEVER been successful throughout world history.

Read that highlighted text again and commit it to memory and you'll understand a huge part of why the majority in the country believes we are currently headed in the wrong direction.