Liberal Forum

heh... Let them whine.It's what they do best.

Jesus H. Christ on a bike , you're like a recurring rash with huge oozing open sores.Your usual kind self.heh... Let them whine.It's what they do best. What do you do other spread Disinformation and lies and whine endlessly?More Democrat committed voter fraud. Gosh, wasn't Obama really, really, really close to ACORN?And gosh, look at all the Democrat politicians/ officials who disagree with your Democrat Talking Point Lies.More Acorn Voter Fraud Comes to LightCongressional Democrats still want the group to be eligible for federal money.By JOHN FUNDDemocrats are split on how to deal with Acorn, the liberal "community organizing" group that deployed thousands of get-out-the-vote workers last election. State and city Democratic officials -- who've been contending with its many scandals -- are moving against it. Washington Democrats are still sweeping Acorn abuses under a rug.On Monday, Nevada officials charged Acorn, its regional director and its Las Vegas field director with submitting thousands of fraudulent voter registration forms last year. Larry Lomax, the registrar of voters in Las Vegas, says he believes 48% of Acorn's forms "are clearly fraudulent." On Thursday, prosecutors in Pittsburgh, Pa., also charged seven Acorn employees with filing hundreds of fraudulent voter registrations before last year's general election.Acorn spokesman Scott Levenson calls the Nevada criminal complaint "political grandstanding" and says that any problems were the actions of an unnamed "bad employee." But Catherine Cortez Masto, Nevada's Democratic Attorney General, told the Las Vegas Sun that Acorn itself is named in the criminal complaint. She says that Acorn's training manuals "clearly detail, condone and . . . require illegal acts," such as requiring its workers to meet strict voter-registration targets to keep their jobs.Other Democrats on the ground have complaints. Fred Voight, deputy election commissioner in Philadelphia, protested after Acorn (according to the registrar of voters and his own investigation) submitted at least 1,500 fraudulent registrations last fall. "This has been going on for a number of years," he told CNN in October. St. Louis Democrat Matthew Potter, the city's deputy elections director, had similar complaints.Elsewhere, Washington state prosecutors fined Acorn $25,000 after several employees were convicted of voter registration fraud in 2007. The group signed a consent decree with King County (Seattle), requiring it to beef up its oversight or face criminal prosecution. In the 2008 election, Acorn's practices led to investigations, some ongoing, in 14 other states.The stink is bad enough that some congressional Democrats have taken notice. At a March 19 hearing on election problems, Michigan Rep. John Conyers, chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, pressed New York Rep. Gerald Nadler, chairman of the Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights and Civil Liberties, to hold a hearing on Acorn. He called the charges against it "serious." Mr. Nadler agreed to consider the request.Mr. Nadler's office now says there will be no hearing on Acorn because Mr. Conyers has changed his mind. Mr. Conyers's office released a statement on Monday saying that after reviewing "the complaints against Acorn, I have concluded that a hearing on this matter appears unwarranted at this time." A Democratic staffer told me he believes the House leadership put pressure on Mr. Conyers to back down. Mr. Conyers's office says it is "unaware" of any contacts with House leaders.Then there's Barney Frank, the chairman of the House Financial Services Committee. Last month, he voted for a committee amendment (to the Mortgage Reform and Anti-Predatory Lending Act) by Rep. Michelle Bachmann (R., Minn.) to block groups indicted for voter fraud from receiving federal housing or legal assistance grants. Identical language was passed into law in the Housing and Economic Recovery Act of 2008. Mr. Frank now says he "had not read [the amendment] carefully" before backing it. He gutted the amendment on Thursday, claiming that the language Congress passed just last year is "a violation of the basic principles of due process."A lot of money is at stake. In the stimulus bill passed by Congress, Acorn is eligible -- along with other activist groups -- to apply for $2 billion in funds to redevelop abandoned and foreclosed homes. Meanwhile, public records show that last spring the IRS filed three tax liens totaling almost $1 million against Acorn, most of which concerned employee withholding.All of this infuriates Marcel Reid, who, along with seven other national Acorn board members, was removed last year after demanding an audit of the group's books. "Acorn has been hijacked by a power-hungry clique that has its own political and personal agendas," she told me. "We are fighting to take back the group."Bertha Lewis, the head of Acorn, told me last year before their ouster that the "Acorn Eight" were "obsessed" and "confused." But Anita MonCrief, an Acorn whistleblower, says the problems run deep. Ms. MonCrief worked at Project Vote, an Acorn affiliate, in late 2007. She says its development director, Karen Gillette, told her she had direct contact with the Obama campaign and also told her to call Obama donors who had maxed out on donations to the candidate but who could contribute to Acorn. Project Vote calls her charges "absolutely false." (Ms. Gillette has declined comment.)Acorn's relationship to the Obama campaign is a matter of public record. Last year, Citizens Consulting Inc., the umbrella group controlling Acorn, was paid $832,000 by the Obama campaign for get-out-the-vote efforts in key primary states. In filings with the Federal Election Commission, the campaign listed the payments as "staging, sound, lighting," only correcting them after reporters from the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review revealed their true nature.Mr. Obama distanced himself from the group's scandals last year, saying "We don't need Acorn's help." Nevertheless, he got his start as a community organizer at Acorn's side. In 1992, he headed a registration effort for Project Vote, an Acorn partner at the time. In 1995, he represented Acorn in a key case upholding the new Motor Voter Act -- the very law whose mandated postcard registration system Acorn workers use to flood election offices with bogus registrations.But Acorn's registration tricks may soon be unnecessary. Congressional Democrats are backing a bill to mandate a nationwide data base to automatically register driver's license holders or recipients of government benefits.This "would create an engraved invitation for voter fraud," says Hans von Spakovsky, a former Federal Election Commission member, who points out that these lists are filled with felons and noncitizens who are ineligible to vote. Ironically, in light of its troubles with the law, Acorn was selected in March to assist the U.S. Census in reaching out to minority communities and recruiting census enumerators for the count next year.As for the Nevada indictment, Acorn isn't worried. "We've had bad publicity before, and all it does is inform the community that we're here working for the community," Bonnie Greathouse, Acorn's head organizer in Nevada, assured the Las Vegas Review-Journal this week. "People always come forward to our defense. We're just community organizers, just like the president used to be."http://online.wsj.co...0646102435.html Edited by RichClem, 05 October 2011 - 02:12 PM.

This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by RichClem . View it anyway?The proverbial bad penny.

Jon Stewart points out the hypocrisy of Conservatives who called the Tea Party protesters patriots, but now refer to the Occupy Wall Street protesters as a bunch of disenfranchised Anti-America park-dwellers.It's especially interesting to see how Fox News is covering these protests as opposed to how they promoted covered the Tea Party protests.VIDEO

your pic of the outs is missing Cain.

Jon Stewart points out the hypocrisy of Conservatives who called the Tea Party protesters patriots, but now refer to the Occupy Wall Street protesters as a bunch of disenfranchised Anti-America park-dwellers.It's especially interesting to see how Fox News is covering these protests as opposed to how they promoted covered the Tea Party protests.What's hypocritical about that? The Tea Party supports the Constitution and the country's Founding Principles. That does make them patriots, duuuh!Why would the rest of the State-run liberal MSM be so hostile to these patriots, falsely portraying them as racists and extremists?The Wall St protesters don't know what they stand for, other than that they're really upset!Gosh, here's more Democrat voter fraud. Close your eyes!Say, wasn't Obama very, very, very close to ACORN?An Acorn Whistleblower Testifies in CourtThe group's ties to Obama are extensive.By JOHN FUNDAcorn, the liberal "community organizing" group that claims it will deploy 15,000 get-out-the-vote workers on Election Day, can't stay out of the news.The FBI is investigating its voter registration efforts in several states, amid allegations that almost a third of the 1.3 million cards it turned in are invalid. And yesterday, a former employee of Acorn testified in a Pennsylvania state court that the group's quality-control efforts were "minimal or nonexistent" and largely window dressing. Anita MonCrief also says that Acorn was given lists of potential donors by several Democratic presidential campaigns, including that of Barack Obama, to troll for contributions.The Obama campaign denies it "has any ties" to Acorn, but Mr. Obama's ties are extensive. In 1992 he headed a registration effort for Project Vote, an Acorn partner at the time. He did so well that he was made a top trainer for Acorn's Chicago conferences. In 1995, he represented Acorn in a key case upholding the constitutionality of the new Motor Voter Act -- the first law passed by the Clinton administration -- which created the mandated, nationwide postcard voter registration system that Acorn workers are using to flood election offices with bogus registrations.Ms. MonCrief testified that in November 2007 Project Vote development director Karyn Gillette told her she had direct contact with the Obama campaign and had obtained their donor lists. Ms. MonCrief also testified she was given a spreadsheet to use in cultivating Obama donors who had maxed out on donations to the candidate, but who could contribute to voter registration efforts. Project Vote calls the allegation "absolutely false."She says that when she had trouble with what appeared to be duplicate names on the list, Ms. Gillette told her she would talk with the Obama campaign and get a better version. Ms. MonCrief has given me copies of the donor lists she says were obtained from other Democratic campaigns, as well as the 2004 DNC donor lists.In her testimony, Ms. MonCrief says she was upset by Acorn's "Muscle for Money" program, which she said intimidated businesses Acorn opposed into paying "protection" money in the form of grants. Acorn's Brian Kettering says the group only wants to change corporate behavior: "Acorn is proud of its corporate campaigns to stop abuses of working families."Ms. MonCrief, 29, never expected to testify in a case brought by the state's Republican Party seeking the local Acorn affiliate's voter registration lists. An idealistic graduate of the University of Alabama, she joined Project Vote in 2005 because she thought it was empowering poor people. A strategic consultant for Acorn and a development associate with its Project Vote voter registration affiliate, Ms. MonCrief sat in on policy-making meetings with the national staff. She was fired early this year over personal expenses she had put on the group's credit card.She says she became disillusioned because she saw that Acorn was run as the personal fiefdom of Wade Rathke, who founded the group in 1970 and ran it until he stepped down to take over its international operations this summer. Mr. Rathke's departure as head of Acorn came after revelations he'd employed his brother Dale for a decade while keeping from almost all of Acorn's board members the fact that Dale had embezzled over $1 million from the group a decade ago. (The embezzlement was confirmed to me by an Acorn official.)"Anyone who questioned what was going on was viewed as the enemy," Ms. MonCrief told me. "Just like the mob, no one leaves Acorn happily." She believes the organization does some good but hopes its current leadership is replaced. She may not be alone.Last August two of Acorn's eight dissident board members, Marcel Reed and Karen Inman, filed suit demanding access to financial records of Citizens Consulting Inc., the umbrella group through which most of Acorn's money flows. Ms. Inman told a news conference this month Mr. Rathke still exercises power over CCI and Acorn against the board's wishes. Bertha Lewis, the interim head of Acorn, told me Mr. Rathke has no ties to Acorn and that the dissident board members were "obsessed" and "confused."According to public records, the IRS filed three tax liens totaling almost $1 million against Acorn this spring. Also this spring, CCI was paid $832,000 by the Obama campaign for get-out-the-vote efforts in key primary states. In filings with the Federal Election Commission, the Obama campaign listed the payments as "staging, sound, lighting," only correcting the filings after the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review revealed their true nature."Acorn needs a full forensic audit," Ms. MonCrief says, though she doesn't think that's likely. "Everyone wants to paper things over until later," she says. "But it may be too late to reform Acorn then." She strongly supports Barack Obama and hopes his allies can be helpful in cleaning up the group "after the heat of the election is gone."Acorn's Mr. Kettering says the GOP lawsuit "is designed to suppress legitimate voters," and he says Ms. MonCrief isn't credible, given that she was fired for cause. Ms. MonCrief admits that she left after she began paying back some $3,000 in personal expenses she charged on an Acorn credit card. "I was very sorry, and I was paying it back," she says, but "suddenly Acorn decided that . . . I had to go. Since then I have gotten warnings to 'back off' from people at Acorn."Acorn insists it operates with strict quality controls, turning in, as required by law, all registration forms "even if the name on them was Donald Duck," as Wade Rathke told me two years ago. Acorn whistleblowers tell a different story."There's no quality control on purpose, no checks and balances," says Nate Toler, who worked until 2006 as the head organizer of an Acorn campaign against Wal-Mart in California. And Ms. MonCrief says it is longstanding practice to blame bogus registrations on lower-level employees who then often face criminal charges, a practice she says Acorn internally calls "throwing folks under the bus."Gregory Hall, a former Acorn employee, says he was told on his very first day in 2006 to engage in deceptive fund-raising tactics. Mr. Hall has founded a group called Speaking Truth to Power to push for a full airing of Acorn's problems "so the group can heal itself from within."To date, Mr. Obama has declined to criticize Acorn, telling reporters this month he is happy with his own get-out-the-vote efforts and that "we don't need Acorn's help." That may be true. But there is no denying his ties with Acorn helped turbocharge his political career.http://online.wsj.co...9940482893.html Edited by RichClem, 06 October 2011 - 10:25 AM.

This video shows Fox News correspondent Griff Jenkins interviewing Jesse LaGreca at the Occupy Wall Street protests. In the video, LaGreca speaks articulately about various issues including the media's focus on minor issues such as Obama's birth certificate rather than the important issues facing the country, the difficult conditions faced by the middle class, and Fox News' role in putting the spotlight on Glenn Beck and his comment that Obama is a "racist." The interview was filmed on September 28 for On the Record with Greta Van Susteren, who chose not to air the segment. Instead, Fox News chose to air a video composed of snippets of Occupy Wall Street protesters giving various reasons for their presence at the rally, and then concluded that there was no unified reason for the protest. It neglected to air a video of one of the protesters making a lucid, reasoned argument for change and equality and holding Fox accountable for its behavior. Fair and balanced, as usual. Luckily someone else was also filming the interview.

Former Democratic Congressman Alan Grayson was the first guest to ever get a standing ovation on Real Time with Bill Maher last night, when he owned P.J. O'Rourke.Once upon a time PJ O'Rourke was thought in some circles to be a humorist. Not so much anymore. O'Rourke has a hard time getting his head around what this OccupyWallStreet thing is all about, seeing a bunch of goal-less, leaderless protesters, just a bunch of DFH's out playing bongos and smoking dope. Grayson quickly clarifies for O'Rourke why they're there, in beautifully succinct point-by-point form. Grayson: Let me tell what they're talking about. They're complaining about the fact the Wall Street wrecked the economy three years ago and nobody's held responsible for that. Not a single person has been indicted or convicted for destroying twenty percent of our national net worth accumulated over two centuries. They're upset about the fact that they have iron control over economic policies of this country and that one party is a wholly owned subsidiary of wall street and the other party caters to them as well, that's the truth of the matter as you said before. And O'Rourke: Get the man a bongo drum, they've found their spokesman! Grayson: If I O'Rourke: Get your shoes off, get a bongo drum, forget where to go to the bathroom and it's yours. Grayson: If I am the spokesman for all the people who think we should not have twenty four million people in this country who can't find a full time job. Who should not have fifty million people who can't see a doctor when they're sick. That we shouldn't have forty seven million people of this country who need government help to feed themselves. We shouldn't have fifteen million families who owe more on their mortgage than the value of home, OK, I'll be that spokesman.You can watch the video here. Edited by MistyBlue, 08 October 2011 - 03:13 PM.

IMO, Buddy Roemer [R] who is running for president, is the only person who is talking about what is really wrong with this country, and how to fix it.Of course you won't see him on Fox News, and he's not included in the Republican debates.VIDEOSeptember 6th, 2011.....Transcript:MADDOW: I have been so looking forward to this. Joining us tonight for the interview is Republican presidential candidate and former governor of Louisiana, Buddy Roemer. He`s not one of the eight candidates expected to be on stage tomorrow night for the NBC New/"Politico" debate, but we are very happy to have him with us on this stage tonight. Governor, I can`t tell you how happy I am to have you here. BUDDY ROEMER [R], PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Me too, I`m honored to be here. MADDOW: I want to ask you the big obvious question and you can tell me if you think it`s rude and tell me if you don`t want to answer. ROEMER: All right. MADDOW: Jon Huntsman nationwide is polling at 1 percent, 1 percent, 1 percent when he`s lucky. How did he get this blessing as a candidate to be taken seriously as a contender with numbers like that and you did not get that same blessing? ROEMER: I had the same number, slightly better, 1 percent and 2 percent over the last two weeks. I don`t know the answer. My suspicion is it might have to do with money and my approach to it. I could be wrong, Rachel. I`ve been out of politics for 20 years. I`ve been a happy man in Louisiana building a small bank about $1 billion worth. We help jobs get created out in the real world, that`s what I do, I`m a jobs guy, not a lawyer, not a politician. But I`m the only guy running who was a congressman and a governor. And I know this business, and I`m concerned about America, so I entered four weeks ago. I have slowly crept up to my 1 percent and 2 percent. I will add to that over time, but here`s my difference, $100 limit, no PAC money, no super PAC money, and I fully disclose every penny that I collect. I`ve had all 50 states participate, Guam and Puerto Rico, I don`t know what`s wrong with those guys, but they are helping me. So, I am building. I will get on a debate, Rachel. It will happen. My issues are jobs and the corruptive power of big money in campaigns. Those are my two issues. No one else talks about it, no one else cares about it. I want a president with passion about jobs, and that`s what I expect from Mr. Obama the day after tomorrow. That`s what I`m looking for. Not a specific plan, but I want passion for jobs. This country`s in trouble. I don`t see it in the Republican Party. I don`t see it in the presidency. I`m concerned, that`s why I`m running. MADDOW: After 20 years or so out of politics, why jump back in at the presidential level? Why try to get back into politics without national name recognition, without a national base? ROEMER: That`s a good question, and I never really thought of it that way. And maybe the game passed me by. It used to be that I built my political career, and I served in the constitutional convention, I wrote a Constitution with the help of others, Congress for four terms, and governor, that I would build it slowly over time on the issues. I`m an issues wonk, I like it. I like how to improve the country. I have found since I`ve come back in the last couple of months, and I`ve been doing this for about seven months, exploratory, and now running, that the pace has picked up. I like that, I`m getting up to speed in that. But it`s so television-oriented. Rachel, it used to be -- I won the governor`s race in Louisiana with no PAC money, with a limit. I spent $1 million, the guy that I beat spend $16 million, but I did it with newspaper support, newspapers were so important then. They are less important now. So, I`m learning kind of the new game, and that`s why I`ve slowly begun to build. I`m in New Hampshire. I rest my case in New Hampshire, it`s like I`m running for governor there. My limited funds will also be spent there.I mean, if I can get 1 million people to give me $10, I`ll spend it in New Hampshire. We`ll win the Republican nomination and revolutionize politics in this country. It`s all about the money. It`s about the big checks and special interests, Rachel, and it`s Democrat and Republican. I see no difference. MADDOW: And on the issue of campaign finance -- I mean, we have seen a gradual change over the course of a generation until the last couple of years where that gradual change has gone off a cliff. ROEMER: Yes. MADDOW: Five Supreme Court decisions that have dismantled the meager campaign finance laws that we had. Are you, and is anybody, structurally incapable of making a campaign finance case at the national level, because by definition, you can`t raise the money to make the case against big money? ROEMER: We`ll see. It`s a dilemma.I mean, I would have a rule that lobbyists registered with the federal government could not give a check to a candidate. I would have a rule that you`d have a 48-hour reporting period, not 90 or 150 days, Rachel. Let`s know where the money`s coming from. I would have a rule that PACs could give no more than individuals, whatever the limit is, $1,000, $2,500. I would have a rule there`d be no super PACs. I would have a rule that there would be criminal penalties for violation of these rules that does not abrogate the close Supreme Court vote 5-4 that money is speech. As a conservative I believe money is speech. But you can`t yell fire in a crowded theater incorrectly. There can be broad limits and I think the Supreme Court has said it. Now, one final point. Conservatives like myself have argued for full disclosure, sun light. Liberals, like yourself, often argue for limits on giving. Right now, we have neither. We have the worst of both worlds.We have Mitt Romney taking $1 million check in a super PAC and not disclosing it to anybody until forced to. We have campaign chiefs of staff, in Mr. Obama`s case and in several other candidates` case, who are running the so-called independent PACs. I mean, it is -- it is morally wrong in my mind and hurtful to the American politics. OK, if we have no limits, let`s have full disclosure. Now we have neither. MADDOW: I would say, sir, that whether or not you have a chance of winning the nomination of the structural constraints you are under, the fact that you are running has you on places like "The Daily Show" and this show and other shows across the country talking about this and embarrassing everybody else who will engage on the subject. And for that, I congratulate. ROEMER: I`m a proud Republican, but I`m a prouder American. This is about America, Rachel. Something`s wrong in our system, and it`s special interest money. Unfair trade with China, I love to talk about it all day. Now, that`s a jobs program the president ought to stand for. He ought to protect American jobs. I`d support him if he did. Nobody else is doing it.MADDOW: Buddy Roemer, Republican presidential candidate, former governor of Louisiana -- sir, will you come back during this campaign? ROEMER: Absolutely. MADDOW: Thank you. It`s great to have you here. ROEMER: Thanks, Rachel. Good to see you. Edited by MistyBlue, 08 October 2011 - 08:15 PM.

The GOP myth of rampant voter fraud.....Myth.Chicago!!! Philadelphia!! New Orleans!!!You're not blind, so you must be lying.Former Justice Department official Hans von Spakovsky discusses in a recent Heritage Foundatioin report a shocking 1982 election for Governor in Illinois in which 10% of the votes cast in Chicago, 100,000 overall, were found to be fraudulent by a federal grand jury investigation that produced 63 criminal convictions for vote fraud. Spakovsky writes: One primary method of perpetuating such fraud was for impersonators to vote in the name of dead people, people who had moved away, and fraudulently registered names. Impersonators were sometimes paid in cigarettes, liquor, or cash, known in the trade as "walking around money." Votes for a straight Democrat ticket, regardless of the actual voter's preferences, were also cast for the elderly, the disabled, and the sick who were unaware of what was going on. Then Chicago U.S. Attorney Dan Webb estimated that 80,000 illegal aliens were registered to vote in the city at the time, and that was 25 years ago. Precinct captains filled out absentee ballots obtained by others, and absentee ballots with Republican votes were trashed. Another method was to alter the vote count by repeatedly running straight party line ballots through the counting machine, or altering the counting machine vote totals. Unfortunately, as Spakovsky notes, the Justice Department has never again engaged in such a thorough investigation of vote fraud.http://spectator.org.../22/voter-fraudAnd on the basis of that, Republicans are willing to disenfranchise as many as 5 million voters, most of whom would probably vote Democratic.According to a study done by the Brennan Center For Justice, as many as 5 million voters will be disenfranchised by Voter ID laws passed in Republican states.You can't even get on an airplane or cash a check without an ID.More DNC Disinformation. Former Democratic Congressman Alan Grayson was the first guest to ever get a standing ovation on Real Time with Bill Maher last night, when he owned P.J. O'Rourke.Figures they'd applaud a shameless lying moonbat like Grayson. And how typical a shameless lying leftist like you would take him seriously. Grayson: Let me tell what they're talking about. They're complaining about the fact the Wall Street wrecked the economy three years ago and nobody's held responsible for that. Not a single person has been indicted or convicted for destroying twenty percent of our national net worth accumulated over two centuries. They're upset about the fact that they have iron control over economic policies of this country and that one party is a wholly owned subsidiary of wall street and the other party caters to them as well, that's the truth of the matter as you said before. And Grayson: If I am the spokesman for all the people who think we should not have twenty four million people in this country who can't find a full time job.I'm glad to see that Grayson is denouncing his own party, at long last.It was Democrats who wrote Fannie, Freddy and liberal lending policies into law. who protected them when Bush and Repubs tried to reform them years before the collapse.It was Democrats who were the strongest supporters of TARP, who funnel taxpayer money to Wall St. companies like Goldman Sachs.

From Daily Kos:If you didn't see Jesse La Greca (Ministry of Truth) this morning facing off against George Will, Donna Brazile, Peggy Noonan, Matthew Dowd, and Christiane Amanpour, you can see it now. (Well, if you can sit through a commercial first...) There's some preliminary shots to set up the story, pronouncements from the regular round table crew who get to pontificate and tell us what we should think. And then the fun begins. Watch the clueless aristocrats wrinkle their noses in disgust. Listen to the DC establishment try to wrap their minds around the spectacle of a commoner being heard, one who's not following the script. See an actual live working person speak his mind clearly, plainly, and politely.Watch Video HereFull TranscriptChristiane: George, the protesters are railing against Wall Street. Its a lot of what the Tea Party did in the early days. Is there a comparison to be made here?Will: No, because the Tea Party was the bourgeoisie in revolt and they immediately went into the business of winning elections and running candidates. I disagree with some of the Republicans. I, I wish for the OWS demonstrators long life and ample publicity for two reasons [note: Peggy Noonans fawning, smirk here is priceless]. I think they do represent the spirit and intellect of the American left, but also, I remember the 1960s. We had 4 years of demonstrations like this leading up to 1968 when Nixon/Wallace vote was 57% of the country reacting against the demonstrators, and Republicans went on to win 5 of the next 6 presidential elections.Donna: I disagree. I dont think its the same protestors that showed up in the late 60s, early 70s. I think this represents a different movement.Christiane: Is it Tea Party like?Donna: Tea Party like? Well, I dont know. I hope its heavy on coffee and not on tea, but I do believe that its a legitimate movement that grew out of the public outrage over the debt ceiling debate when many Americans saw members of congress basically sitting on their hands doing nothing. These are educated people who cannot find jobs. They have worked hard, played by the rules, and they believe that Wall Street has not been held to account for their actions that created the mess in the first place.Christiane: Peggy, do you think that people are too quick to dismiss them?Peggy: Aaaahh, maybe, look, to a certain degree, the OWS folks are reflective of a bitterness that has not gone away in America in the past three years that has accentuated as the economy has gotten worse. A bitter sense out there that Washington, and the investment banks of NY tanked the American economy and paid no price for it. That having been said, OWS, these protestors is nothing like the Tea Party. The Tea Party rose up spontaneously, as I assume these folks have, but they were mature, they had a program, they had a political point of view that they were going to put into legislative action. They made serious political decisions about not going third party. They were real. We dont yet know yet that these folks are real. Can I tell you though, the Republican party should not take the bait of OWS, and they should not do this replaying of 1968 where the Republicans say, protesters are bad. The protesters are doing their thing. Let them be.Dowd: I think the Republicans are making a huge mistake on this, because I think if I were a Republican candidate, or advising a Republican candidate today, I would say, Adopt this populist movement, because right now, I think the Republican party has forgotten who their base is. The Republican partys base is not Wall Street. The Republican partys base is a middle class, small town, rural vote out there, and not to say the Republicans agree with that, but I think the Eric Cantors and everybody else out there who are dismissing these folks, if I were Michele Bachmann or somebody else in that field, I would say, this is a Main Street vs. Wall Street problem; these protesters are saying the right thing. They may not have the right policies, but be a populist, and be a populist Republican attacking Wall Street.Christiane: OK, weve spoken a lot about them. Im now going to bring in Jesse LaGreca who is a blogger for the liberal web site Daily Kos, and hes been a fixture at the Wall Street protest. So Jesse, youve been listening to all of these descriptions of your movement. Where do you come down? I mean, weve talked about it as being immature, it hasnt had a policy, sort of directive. What is it you are sort of trying to consolidate around there?Jesse: I think the matter at hand is that the working class people in America, you know, the 99% of Americans who arent wealthy, and arent prospering in this economy have been entirely ignored by the media. Our political leaders pander to us, but they dont take action. They stand in the way of change. They filibuster on behalf of the wealthiest 1%; they fold on behalf of the wealthiest 1%. So, the conversation we need to have is about the future, about what type of country we really want to be, and I think the most important thing we can do in our occupation is to continue to push the narrative thats been ignored by so many pundits and political leaders. I mean, the reality is, Im the only working class person youre going to see on Sunday news, political news, maybe ever; and I think thats very indicative of the failures of our media to report on the news that matters most to our working class people.Christiane: We are trying our best, Jesse, ..Jesse: And I thank you.Christiane: and I want to ask you, some of your, you know, most vociferous supporters, you know like our colleague Paul Krugman, have spoken quite glowingly about this populist movement, and youve even heard people around this table saying that it should be harnessed, but also saying that its the moment now, to perhaps try to translate that into some kind of political question, political demand. Is there something that you can make this about? Jesse: I think the entire movement is about economic justice, I mean to me, and Im not speaking in behalf of OWS, Im just giving my personal opinion, I think its a matter of economic rights, and I think its a matter of social rights and social justice; and to the people who would take offense at the word social being placed before justice, Id invite them to re-read the constitution.Christiane: Let me ask George Will who wanted to ask you a quick question.Will: Mr. LaGreca, I hear a certain dissonance in your message. Your message is, Washington is corrupt. Washington is the handmaiden of the powerful, and a lot of conservatives agree with that, but then you say, this corrupt Washington thats the handmaiden of the powerful should be much more powerful in regulating our lives. Why do you want a corrupt government bigger in our lives?Jesse: You know, I find that a lot of these conversations about the government tend to deflect away from Wall Street, because, lets be honest. The lobbyists have enormous power, and theyve shut out the voice of the American people. So, I think we should demand a government that is listening to people, and I find it ironic that when people demand action from their government, suddenly people tend to overreact and say, Well thats out of control government.Our government is a function of our democracy. By attacking the government, we are attacking democracy. So, to me, I think, yes, we should ask our government to represent the will of the people, and the will of the people are demanding action, then they should follow suit.Christiane: Do you think these demonstrations are going to have momentum? I mean, is it going to continue now, day after day?Jesse: Absolutely. People are extremely excited about what were doing. Were engaging in a direct democracy conversation. I mean, the General Assembly is really the new Town Hall, and we dont have a filibuster. We dont have lobbyists. We dont have a system that can be co-opted, and I invite everybody to come down and talk to us.Christiane: Jesse, thank you so much, indeed, I appreciate you being here.Let me ask you Donna, clearly, unions and other democratic organizations are jumping on this. Is this something that the Democratic party feels will energize it as the Tea Party did the Republican party?Donna: There is no question that Democrats recognize the strength of this movement. This is a grassroots movement. On the other hand, I dont believe that the party itself should try to lead this. Yes, teachers, firefighters, many others who have been impacted by the ongoing recession, they have a legitimate right to go out there and protest. George, many of these Americans are feeling the effect of the economy, foreclosures. How many Americans out there have lost their homes, or their homes are underwater? This is a legitimate movement, and we should not try to marginalize it.Christiane: Peggy, I was stunned by your column this week where you were talking about a group of Wall Street, sorry Walmart moms, and you were talking about people who were taking extraordinary steps to save money: donating blood, ..Peggy: yes,..Christiane: collecting aluminum cans, ..Peggy: yes, they are, I think we can all sometimes miss what is really happening in America. America is in distress. Its in immediate distress, paying the bills, foreclosures, etc. But another kind of distress its under, is Americans are smart, and they can tell, this aint gonna get better for a while. So there is a certain, bitterness is too strong a word, despair is too strong, but maybe very upset, and not feeling so great about the future. It seems to me the question about OWS is this: what. Is. Your. Plan. Are ya gonna spend the next six months blocking the Brooklyn Bridge? Or are you going to harness a movement into political action which means getting together with each other in living rooms [Peggy, dear, some of us dont have living rooms any more], deciding CrosstalkChristiane: Im going to have to ask Jesse that. Very quickly, did you hear that, Jesse? Are you still there?Jesse: Yes, Im still here.Christiane: Are you going to harness this into a political movement, or are you going to, you know, hang out for months?Jesse: What I find amusing, it that now people are looking to us to solve the political problems, and they should. But Im not going to support one party or the other. Im not going to tell you who to vote for, but I will encourage you to be a voter. I think we have succeeded tremendously in pushing the narrative that working class people can no longer be ignored, and I think that its very important that we have this conversation, because its about the future of our country. You know, right now, working class people are being told to sacrifice. Were being told that our future is going to have to be put on hold in the name of austerity, and I cant name a single country that has succeeded in solving their economic problems with austerity. So, I think the more important thing to do, is to come out and speak to us. The town halls that you see are very top heavy. Our political leaders come and try to sell us a message.Christiane: OKJesse: They should be listening to us.Christiane: Alright, Jesse, thank you very much, indeed.

MistyBlue, on 07 October 2011 - 06:58 PM, said:The GOP myth of rampant voter fraud.....Myth.Chicago!!! Philadelphia!! New Orleans!!!You're not blind, so you must be lying.Former Justice Department official Hans von Spakovsky discusses in a recent Heritage Foundatioin report a shocking 1982 election for Governor in Illinois in which 10% of the votes cast in Chicago, 100,000 overall, were found to be fraudulent by a federal grand jury investigation that produced 63 criminal convictions for vote fraud.You're the blind one.Once again, I'm not talking about 1982, Jackhole.In 2002, Karl Rove decided to make a big thing about voter fraud, so he could discredit Democrats.The Bush Justice Dept. launched a five year crackdown to expose Democratic voter fraud.This is what they found.....From 2002 to 2007, 120 people were charged and 86 convicted.Many of those charged by the Justice Department appear to have mistakenly filled out registration forms or misunderstood eligibility rules.So this GOP myth of dead people voting, or people voting twice, is just that, a myth.Don't you remember how Karl Rove had a bunch of U.S. Attorneys fired because they refused to bring voter fraud cases against Democrats, citing lack of evidence?BTW, he wanted them to bring those political cases right before an election, which is against DOJ policy anyway.The myth of widespread Democratic voter fraud is a red herring being used by the GOP to disenfranchise as many as 5 million voters.

But yall still can't do a chad without hanging it up.

Former Justice Department official Hans von Spakovsky discusses in a recent Heritage Foundatioin report a shocking 1982 election for Governor in Illinois in which 10% of the votes cast in Chicago, 100,000 overall, were found to be fraudulent by a federal grand jury investigation that produced 63 criminal convictions for vote fraud.You're the blind one.Once again, I'm not talking about 1982, Jackhole.Ignoring the vast amount of evidence I've cited and the sources' opinions. Voter fraud is extremely difficult to prosecute, and as Spakovsky noted, the Justice Dept, being an institution of the Beltway, has stopped even trying.In 2002, Karl Rove decided to make a big thing about voter fraud, so he could discredit Democrats.The Bush Justice Dept. launched a five year crackdown to expose Democratic voter fraud.Repubs cannot possibly push an uncooperative bureaucracy into action.Every body of the federal government is hostile to Republicans and accommodating to Democrats; the Labor Dept. Dept. of Education, EPA, Justice Dept., etc, etc, etc, etc.So this GOP myth of dead people voting, or people voting twice, is just that, a myth.If your word is to be accepted, Clinton is absolutely innocent, because Beltway politicians in the Senate were too cowardly to hold a real trial on all charges.Proving that you're a shameless liar who'll stonewall undeniable evidence to the end of the earth.The myth of widespread Democratic voter fraud is a red herring being used by the GOP to disenfranchise as many as 5 million voters.The usual Democrat Talking Point Lie. Honest political figures including many Democrats are deeply disturbed at the widespread voter fraud across the country, which is why even Democrat-run Rhode Island is among many states beginning to crack down on the sloppy procedures the Democrat Party has fought so hard to achieve.By which they commit massive voter fraud as Modus Operandi every major election.

I love me some Buddy Roemer. (Republican candidate for President)Roemer talks about the OWS protests:VIDEORoemer met with the OWS protesters:VIDEORoemer: I found them to be American. I know they`ve been called un-American. I found them to be very American. I found them to be concerned about their country. I didn`t agree with all of their particulars, but they ask questions. You know what America needs to do? It needs to ask questions of a system that`s broken. And that`s what they`re doing. I love them there. I remember -- I`m an old man. I`m 68. I remember the Vietnam protests when I was in college. I remember the civil rights protests on my city streets when I was a young man in the Deep South. They changed America. The politicians need to listen to these young people. It could change America.They didn`t say bring America down. They didn`t say I want something from the federal government. They said fair play, Buddy, fair play.

Voter fraud is extremely difficult to prosecute, and as Spakovsky noted, the Justice Dept, being an institution of the Beltway, has stopped even trying.That's a blatant lie. You just make **** up as you go along. In 2002 John Ashcroft started the U.S. Department of Justice, Ballot Access and Voting Integrity Initiative. Ashcroft said, "weve made enforcement of election fraud and corruption offenses a top priority."Got that Puss? It was a top priority. Not only did they not stop trying to prove voter fraud, they stepped up their efforts.You can read the DOJ's own report here, where it shows 55 people convicted of voter fraud in a five year period from 2002 to 2005, and precious few of those convictions were for people who voted twice.The usual Democrat Talking Point Lie. Honest political figures including many Democrats are deeply disturbed at the widespread voter fraud across the country...Another blatant lie. According to Bush's own Justice Dep't, there is no widespread voter fraud. But you choose to believe there is, so you can defend the filthy tactics used by Republicans to disenfranchise millions of voters.

Instead, Fox News chose to air a video composed of snippets of Occupy Wall Street protesters giving various reasons for their presence at the rally, and then concluded that there was no unified reason for the protest. It neglected to air a video of one of the protesters making a lucid, reasoned argument for change and equality and holding Fox accountable for its behavior. Fair and balanced, as usual.There is no unified reason for the protest, duuuh!I got as far as the little lefty claiming it was a low point in US politics that Glen Beck claimed Obama dislikes white people.He spent 20 years at Trinity listening to that virulent racist Reverend Wright and made the racist, anti-American, anti-Semitic marxist/Communist his spiritual adviser.And speaking of crooked media, why did the entire State-run liberal MSM cover up Obama's racist, leftist background and personal philosophy?

Voter fraud is extremely difficult to prosecute, and as Spakovsky noted, the Justice Dept, being an institution of the Beltway, has stopped even trying.That's a blatant lie. You just make [excrement] up as you go along. Gosh, who should we believe, a shameless Democrat Operative Liar like you or a respected person/ public official like Hans Spakovsky?Among other responsibilities, von Spakovsky researches and writes about aspects of election law such as campaign finance, voter fraud and voter identification as well as registration and equipment issues. These have emerged as important topics in an era of razor-thin victory margins for national candidates. Before joining Heritage in 2008, hZ served two years as a member of the Federal Election Commission, the authority charged with enforcing campaign finance laws for congressional and presidential elections, including public funding.http://www.heritage....s-von-spakovskyGot that Puss? It was a top priority. Not only did they not stop trying to prove voter fraud, they stepped up their efforts.You can read the DOJ's own report here, where it shows 55 people convicted of voter fraud in a five year period from 2002 to 2005, and precious few of those convictions were for people who voted twice.Another blatant lie. According to Bush's own Justice Dep't, there is no widespread voter fraud. But you choose to believe there is, so you can defend the filthy tactics used by Republicans to disenfranchise millions of voters.That's the freaking point. Without voter ID, there is no evidence so there can be no prosecutions.Even liberal Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens and partisan liberal Democrat Chris Mathews think you're full of crap.The claim that there is no voter fraud in the U.S. is patently ridiculous, given our rich and unfortunate history of it. As the U.S. Supreme Court said when it upheld Indiana's photo-ID law in 2008, "Flagrant examples of such fraud . . . have been documented throughout this Nation's history by respected historians and journalists." The liberal groups that fought Indiana's law didn't have much luck with liberal justice John Paul Stevens, who wrote the 63 decision. Before being named to the Supreme Court, Justice Stevens practiced law in Chicago, a hotbed of electoral malfeasance.....One of the reasons that Wisconsin changed its voter-ID law was the finding of a special task force, set up by the Milwaukee Police Department after the 2004 election, that residents from other states had registered and voted. Numerous staffers from out of state working for the John Kerry campaign and the Environmental Victory Campaign, a liberal political-action committee, had illegally registered and voted in Milwaukee......Chris Matthews, a former Tip O'Neill staffer and reliable liberal cheerleader in most circumstances......admitted that this type of impersonation fraud has "gone on since the Fifties." He explained that people call up to see whether you voted or are going to vote, and "then all of a sudden somebody does come and vote for you." Matthews knows that this is an old strategy in big-city politics: "I know all about it in North Philly it's what went on, and I believe it still goes on."http://www.nationalr...-spakovsky?pg=2

Former Democratic Congressman Alan Grayson was the first guest to ever get a standing ovation on Real Time with Bill Maher last night, when he owned P.J. O'Rourke.Maher and O'Rourke must be buddies, because Maher keeps proppng up that relic with spots on his show and book plugs, even tho he is awkward, unfunny and frankly cringe-inducing.