Liberal Forum

they're sometimes hard to talk into a blow-job.Not if you wear a robe.That sounds great.We're not doing anything either.I like a nice quiet New Year's Eve.I'm at work - have been since 8am. But I'll be crashed by midnight (hope).

But I'll be crashed by midnight (hope). banned word--you'll still be posting, though, right?!

Not if you wear a robe.ROFLI'm at work - have been since 8am. But I'll be crashed by midnight (hope).Happy New Year CP.

Peter King, Furious Over Blocked Sandy Aid, Says Don't Donate To House RepublicansPeter King (R-N.Y.) is going after his fellow House Republicans after party leaders pulled a Hurricane Sandy relief bill from a floor vote on Tuesday, saying that New York and New Jersey residents should stop giving these lawmakers political contributions."I'm saying right now, anyone from New York or New Jersey who contributes one penny to congressional Republicans is out of their minds," he said in an interview on Fox News. "Because what they did last night was put a knife in the back of New Yorkers and New Jerseyans. It was an absolute disgrace."The House adjourned on Tuesday night without passing the $60.4 billion Sandy relief package that the Senate approved last week. The 113th Congress will be sworn in on Thursday, meaning that the House and Senate would have to restart the entire legislative process if it takes it up.House Appropriations Chairman Hal Rogers (R-Ky.) told CNN that money will be approved in the next Congress.[...]King also raised the possibility that he would vote against reelecting House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) to his leadership post in the 113th Congress, saying, "My world turned upside-down last night, so I'm holding every vote in abeyance for now."[...]"I was chasing the Speaker all over the House floor last night, trying to talk to him and his staff," said King on CNN. "He kept telling me wait until the vote is over, wait until the fiscal cliff vote is over, everything will be taken care of. And then he was gone. He refused to meet with us. He actually yelled at Congressman [Frank] LoBiondo, saying, 'I'm not meeting with you people.'"

Pope Slams Capitalism, Inequality Between Rich And Poor In New Years Message The 85-year-old pope rang in the new year with a mass for about 10,000 people in St Peter's Basilica on the day the Roman Catholic Church marks its World Day of Peace with initiatives around the world. [...] He thanked the world's peacemakers, saying they deserve praise for working, often behind the scenes, tirelessly, thanklessly and armed only "with the weapons of prayer and forgiveness". Earlier in his homily, the leader of the world's 1.2 billion Roman Catholics decried "hotbeds of tension and conflict caused by growing instances of inequality between rich and poor". He also denounced "the prevalence of a selfish and individualistic mindset which also finds expression in an unregulated capitalism, various forms of terrorism and criminality". Who knew? The Pope is a Communist.

Who knew? The Pope is a Communist. Organized religion is generally communistic in nature. That's one thing religions and governments agree on, oppressing individualism.

Organized religion is generally communistic in nature. That's one thing religions and governments agree on, oppressing individualism. I agree with Jesse Ventura. “Organized religion is a sham and a crutch for weak-minded people who need strength in numbers. It tells people to go out and stick their noses in other people's business. I live by the golden rule: Treat others as you'd want them to treat you. The religious right wants to tell people how to live.”

I agree with Jesse Ventura. “Organized religion is a sham and a crutch for weak-minded people who need strength in numbers. It tells people to go out and stick their noses in other people's business. I live by the golden rule: Treat others as you'd want them to treat you. The religious right wants to tell people how to live.” The same applies to those on the left in regards to sticking their noses in other people's business. Most people in the middle tend to subscribe to a good portion of the facets of Libertarianism but only through lip-service. I call them confused or at worst, hypocrites. It's like some of those Tea Partiers holding the signs "Big Government is Bad". "Keep your hands off my Social Security."

Chris Christie tears the House GOP and John Boehner a new one. He also reminded them that NY and NJ are not asking for a handout. All they are asking for is some of their own money back. Christie: We are donor states sending much more to Washington...than we ever get back in federal spending.

banned word--you'll still be posting, though, right?! LOFL.

Eight Corporate Subsidies in the Fiscal Cliff Bill, From Goldman Sachs to Disney to NASCARThroughout the months of November and December, a steady stream of corporate CEOs flowed in and out of the White House to discuss the impending fiscal cliff. Many of them, such as Lloyd Blankfein of Goldman Sachs, would then publicly come out and talk about how modest increases of tax rates on the wealthy were reasonable in order to deal with the deficit problem. What wasn’t mentioned is what these leaders wanted, which is what’s known as “tax extenders”, or roughly $205B of tax breaks for corporations. With such a banal name, and boring and difficult to read line items in the bill, few political operatives have bothered to pay attention to this part of the bill. But it is critical to understanding what is going on.The negotiations over the fiscal cliff involve more than the Democrats, Republicans, the middle class and the wealthy. The corporate sector is here in force as well. One of the core shifts in the Reagan era was the convergence of wealthy individuals who wanted to pay less in taxes – many from the growing South – with corporations that wanted tax breaks. Previously, these groups fought over the pie, because the idea of endless deficits did not make sense. Once Reagan figured out how to finance yawning deficits, the GOP was able to wield the corporate sector and the new sun state wealthy into one force, epitomized today by Grover Norquist. What Obama is (sort of) trying to do is split this coalition, and the extenders are the carrot he’s dangling in front of the corporate sector to do it.Most tax credits drop straight to the bottom line – it’s why companies like Enron considered its tax compliance section a “profit center”. A few hundred billion dollars of tax expenditures is a major carrot to offer. Surely, a modest hike in income taxes for people who make more than $400k in income and stupid enough not to take that money in capital gain would be worth trading off for the few hundred billion dollars in corporate pork. This is what the fiscal cliff is about – who gets the money. And by leaving out the corporate sector, nearly anyone who talks about this debate is leaving out a key negotiating partner.So without further ado, here are eight corporate subsidies in the fiscal cliff bill that you haven’t heard of.1) Help out NASCAR - Sec 312 extends the “seven year recovery period for motorsports entertainment complex property”, which is to say it allows anyone who builds a racetrack and associated facilities to get tax breaks on it. This one was projected to cost $43 million over two years.2) A hundred million or so for Railroads - Sec. 306 provides tax credits to certain railroads for maintaining their tracks. It’s unclear why private businesses should be compensated for their costs of doing business. This is worth roughly $165 million a year.3) Disney’s Gotta Eat - Sec. 317 is “Extension of special expensing rules for certain film and television productions”. It’s a relatively straightforward subsidy to Hollywood studios, and according to the Joint Tax Committee, was projected to cost $150m for 2010 and 2011.4) Help a brother mining company out – Sec. 307 and Sec. 316 offer tax incentives for miners to buy safety equipment and train their employees on mine safety. Taxpayers shouldn’t have to bribe mining companies to not kill their workers.5) Subsidies for Goldman Sachs Headquarters – Sec. 328 extends “tax exempt financing for York Liberty Zone,” which was a program to provide post-9/11 recovery funds. Rather than going to small businesses affected, however, this was, according to Bloomberg, “little more than a subsidy for fancy Manhattan apartments and office towers for Goldman Sachs and Bank of America Corp.” Michael Bloomberg himself actually thought the program was excessive, so that’s saying something. According to David Cay Johnston’s The Fine Print, Goldman got $1.6 billion in tax free financing for its new massive headquarters through Liberty Bonds.6) $9B Off-shore financing loophole for banks – Sec. 322 is an “Extension of the Active Financing Exception to Subpart F.” Very few tax loopholes have a trade association, but this one does. This strangely worded provision basically allows American corporations such as banks and manufactures to engage in certain lending practices and not pay taxes on income earned from it. According to this Washington Post piece, supporters of the bill include GE, Caterpillar, and JP Morgan. Steve Elmendorf, super-lobbyist, has been paid $80,000 in 2012 alone to lobby on the “Active Financing Working Group.”7) Tax credits for foreign subsidiaries – Sec. 323 is an extension of the “Look-through treatment of payments between related CFCs under foreign personal holding company income rules.” This gibberish sounding provision cost $1.5 billion from 2010 and 2011, and the US Chamber loves it. It’s a provision that allows US multinationals to not pay taxes on income earned by companies they own abroad.8) Bonus Depreciation, R&D Tax Credit – These are well-known corporate boondoggles. The tax credit was projected to cost $8B for 2010 and 2011, and the depreciation provisions were projected to cost about $110B for those two years, with some of that made up in later years.Conveniently, the Joint Committee on Taxation in 2010 did an analysis of what many of these extenders cost. You can find that report here.So much for Obama being a Socialist. Sounds more like a Corporatist to me.

Eight Corporate Subsidies in the Fiscal Cliff Bill, From Goldman Sachs to Disney to NASCAR Throughout the months of November and December, a steady stream of corporate CEOs flowed in and out of the White House to discuss the impending fiscal cliff. Many of them, such as Lloyd Blankfein of Goldman Sachs, would then publicly come out and talk about how modest increases of tax rates on the wealthy were reasonable in order to deal with the deficit problem. What wasn’t mentioned is what these leaders wanted, which is what’s known as “tax extenders”, or roughly $205B of tax breaks for corporations. With such a banal name, and boring and difficult to read line items in the bill, few political operatives have bothered to pay attention to this part of the bill. But it is critical to understanding what is going on. The negotiations over the fiscal cliff involve more than the Democrats, Republicans, the middle class and the wealthy. The corporate sector is here in force as well. One of the core shifts in the Reagan era was the convergence of wealthy individuals who wanted to pay less in taxes – many from the growing South – with corporations that wanted tax breaks. Previously, these groups fought over the pie, because the idea of endless deficits did not make sense. Once Reagan figured out how to finance yawning deficits, the GOP was able to wield the corporate sector and the new sun state wealthy into one force, epitomized today by Grover Norquist. What Obama is (sort of) trying to do is split this coalition, and the extenders are the carrot he’s dangling in front of the corporate sector to do it. Most tax credits drop straight to the bottom line – it’s why companies like Enron considered its tax compliance section a “profit center”. A few hundred billion dollars of tax expenditures is a major carrot to offer. Surely, a modest hike in income taxes for people who make more than $400k in income and stupid enough not to take that money in capital gain would be worth trading off for the few hundred billion dollars in corporate pork. This is what the fiscal cliff is about – who gets the money. And by leaving out the corporate sector, nearly anyone who talks about this debate is leaving out a key negotiating partner. So without further ado, here are eight corporate subsidies in the fiscal cliff bill that you haven’t heard of. 1) Help out NASCAR - Sec 312 extends the “seven year recovery period for motorsports entertainment complex property”, which is to say it allows anyone who builds a racetrack and associated facilities to get tax breaks on it. This one was projected to cost $43 million over two years. 2) A hundred million or so for Railroads - Sec. 306 provides tax credits to certain railroads for maintaining their tracks. It’s unclear why private businesses should be compensated for their costs of doing business. This is worth roughly $165 million a year. 3) Disney’s Gotta Eat - Sec. 317 is “Extension of special expensing rules for certain film and television productions”. It’s a relatively straightforward subsidy to Hollywood studios, and according to the Joint Tax Committee, was projected to cost $150m for 2010 and 2011. 4) Help a brother mining company out – Sec. 307 and Sec. 316 offer tax incentives for miners to buy safety equipment and train their employees on mine safety. Taxpayers shouldn’t have to bribe mining companies to not kill their workers. 5) Subsidies for Goldman Sachs Headquarters – Sec. 328 extends “tax exempt financing for York Liberty Zone,” which was a program to provide post-9/11 recovery funds. Rather than going to small businesses affected, however, this was, according to Bloomberg, “little more than a subsidy for fancy Manhattan apartments and office towers for Goldman Sachs and Bank of America Corp.” Michael Bloomberg himself actually thought the program was excessive, so that’s saying something. According to David Cay Johnston’s The Fine Print, Goldman got $1.6 billion in tax free financing for its new massive headquarters through Liberty Bonds. 6) $9B Off-shore financing loophole for banks – Sec. 322 is an “Extension of the Active Financing Exception to Subpart F.” Very few tax loopholes have a trade association, but this one does. This strangely worded provision basically allows American corporations such as banks and manufactures to engage in certain lending practices and not pay taxes on income earned from it. According to this Washington Post piece, supporters of the bill include GE, Caterpillar, and JP Morgan. Steve Elmendorf, super-lobbyist, has been paid $80,000 in 2012 alone to lobby on the “Active Financing Working Group.” 7) Tax credits for foreign subsidiaries – Sec. 323 is an extension of the “Look-through treatment of payments between related CFCs under foreign personal holding company income rules.” This gibberish sounding provision cost $1.5 billion from 2010 and 2011, and the US Chamber loves it. It’s a provision that allows US multinationals to not pay taxes on income earned by companies they own abroad. 8) Bonus Depreciation, R&D Tax Credit – These are well-known corporate boondoggles. The tax credit was projected to cost $8B for 2010 and 2011, and the depreciation provisions were projected to cost about $110B for those two years, with some of that made up in later years. Conveniently, the Joint Committee on Taxation in 2010 did an analysis of what many of these extenders cost. You can find that report here. I guess these things are bound to happen when you vote for a bill you've never seen.

I guess these things are bound to happen when you vote for a bill you've never seen.I think they had like 3 minutes to read it before they voted.

I think they had like 3 minutes to read it before they voted. So they had a whole 1.16 seconds to read each page before voting. Why we accept this incompetence is beyond me.

So they had a whole 1.16 seconds to read each page before voting. Why we accept this incompetence is beyond me.I hear ya.

So much for Obama being a Socialist. Sounds more like a Corporatist to me. Or as I like to say...Fascist. Or mebbe a Neo-Maxi-Zoom-Dweebie

I guess these things are bound to happen when you vote for a bill you've never seen. Well...the reality is someone put this stuff IN there,the folks who are so eager to spend a half year to get elected..ought to be able to spend a half day to READ what may be the only thing they do this month. If anyone REALLY cares...I figure it is possible to find out WHICH politician forced each of these porkish loopholes. The million Americans losing ALL unemployment benefits...the few for whom the fiscal cliff was a true CLIFF.....were held hostage. THAT is why the President ended up compromising when otherwise..he had all the leverage. The GOPs would toss those million Americans on a barge and dump them at sea...would not care a bit. The Crybabies who whined about " The Debt" never really CARED. They want to beat up the poorest and most vulnerable, the very old,ill,young,poor. They see them as no longer profitable....just cattle to be sent to the glue factory. However...they were quick to then do handouts to big donors. What a surprise. My fellow Americans used to be wiser,more decent,less self obsessed. Now....a high % are a disgrace.

Well...the reality is someone put this stuff IN there,the folks who are so eager to spend a half year to get elected..ought to be able to spend a half day to READ what may be the only thing they do this month. If anyone REALLY cares...I figure it is possible to find out WHICH politician forced each of these porkish loopholes. The million Americans losing ALL unemployment benefits...the few for whom the fiscal cliff was a true CLIFF.....were held hostage. THAT is why the President ended up compromising when otherwise..he had all the leverage. The GOPs would toss those million Americans on a barge and dump them at sea...would not care a bit. The Crybabies who whined about " The Debt" never really CARED. They want to beat up the poorest and most vulnerable, the very old,ill,young,poor. They see them as no longer profitable....just cattle to be sent to the glue factory. However...they were quick to then do handouts to big donors. What a surprise. My fellow Americans used to be wiser,more decent,less self obsessed. Now....a high % are a disgrace. Really? What was the presidents big compromise? $150,000 on the definition of rich? Give me a friggin' break. Edited by Cedarswamp, 04 January 2013 - 07:57 PM.

I hear ya.That's the result of the Pelosi "We got to pass it so we can read it" deal that we go by now-a-daysIndependent thought not required

MistyBlue, on 04 Jan 2013 - 17:10, said:So much for Obama being a Socialist. Sounds more like a Corporatist to me.Or as I like to say...Fascist.Or mebbe a Neo-Maxi-Zoom-DweebieI like that one.That's the result of the Pelosi "We got to pass it so we can read it" deal that we go by now-a-daysIndependent thought not requiredShe's not running the House now, Boehner is.They need to stop all this last minute **** and give them time to read the stuff they're voting on.They just go from one cliff to another.They're already talking about the next 'cliff' raising the debt ceiling.Republicans are ready to let the country default on the bills that Congress already racked up.(Spending bills originate in the House.)They do this under the pretext of being concerned about the deficit and the national debt, which is a bunch of hogsnot.If they really cared about the deficit or the debt they would have gone after George W. Bush who added trillions to the debt with his two unfunded wars, Medicare Part D and tax cuts, none of which were paid for.They never once gave him a hard time in raising the debt ceiling.If they were serious about cutting spending, they would also include things like defense spending, but they never do.Their real agenda is to dismantle the social safety net, something they have always wanted to do.They don't give a **** about the deficit.